|Help needed to understand ORB||Hello,
No.178 Squadron lost only one Halifax on ops., that being Halifax II BB414, on 4/5-9-1943. This aircraft had a crew of six, 3 of whom were members of the RNZAF, two of them did not survive
Errol Martyn has details in his book, For Your Tomorrow Vol Two. p.138. He 'might' have a Circumstantial Report for this loss, or maybe a Post-Presumption Memorandum, which 'might' tell you the positions of the crew used by 178 Sqn at that time.
Col. ....Read More.||COL BRUGGY on 22nd February 2015 07:21:33|
|Help needed to understand ORB||Thanks all some really helpful advice. I will look up the lost Halifax BB414 and see if I can ID all her crew and cross check it, I have the Sept 43 ORB to start with.
Cheers guys :) ....Read More.||Welshbob on 23rd February 2015 07:18:41|
|Help needed to understand ORB||I managed to ID a WOP from the summery ORB and a Pilot from the war graves site but thats it so far. Two crew killed on BB414 but only the Pilot Sgt Cooke gave his trade, Sgt Gibbs died also but no trade given. I will keep hunting :) ....Read More.||Welshbob on 24th February 2015 08:27:51|
|Help needed to understand ORB||Hello,
Here is something to work on:-
Crew of No.178 Sqn Halifax II BB414.
NZ413027 F/Sgt (Capt./Pilot) Ralph William COOKE RNZAF +
1390374 Sgt (Nav./B) Herbert Richard MANTLE RAFVR +
R/77691 F/Sgt ( - ? - ) Cyril William GIBBS RCAF +
? - ? --------------------------------------------- PoW, later escaped
NZ403627 Sgt (Air Bomber) A I ORR RNZAF - PoW, later escaped
NZ413087 F/Sgt (Air Gnr.[rear]) Lu Henry KAINAMU RNZAF +
Still needs a bit of work. l might have to contact Errol Martyn.
Col. ....Read More.||COL BRUGGY on 24th February 2015 09:00:39|
|Help needed to understand ORB||It turns out Cooke's crew flew the Halifax I am interested in BB331 on many occasions and now I can do those flights details from the data you provided. From what I know and can see so far it seems that the same crews keep the same layout, so each entry for Cooke's crew matches. I think I will need to ID each crew though that flew BB331 to know for sure, in some flights she carried extra crew than normal so the order theory falls down.
Op July 14/15 1943 on BB331
F/Sgt RW Cooke - Pilot
Sgt A G Orr - Bombardier
Sgt HR Mantle - Navigator
F/Sgt CW Gibbs - WOP?
Sgt LF Valentine - Eng?
F/Sgt LH kainamu - Rear Gunner
No mid gunner on BB331 she had no upper turret.
An educated guess that Gibbs was the wireless operator. I can find no record Sgt L F Valentine anywhere on POW sites or war graves so looks like he survived, I know he was on BB414 that fateful night.
Getting there :) ....Read More.||Welshbob on 25th February 2015 09:32:48|
|Help needed to understand ORB||Just a quick update to this. The order of the crews for 178 orbs at least does not stay the same. Now I look deeper at the Cooke crew and know what they all did I find that on different ops they appear in a different sequence. When the crew flew as it did on BB414 as that same crew make up then the sqenece is the same but I have found ops where parts of the crew changed and then the sequence on those ops in the ORB changed. I have no option but to ID every crew man who flew on BB331, no problem as I want to know who they were anyway it will just take me longer.
Cheers ....Read More.||Welshbob on 27th February 2015 04:56:37|
|178 Sqn Losses.||Hello,
Have just received a copy of " Bombers over Sand and Snow"
On page 351 there is a list of a/c losses for the squadron.
"1943 - Halifax - 1 ; Liberators - 5.
1944 - Liberators - 27.
1945 - Liberators - 4".
Were these the a/c lost ?
Confirmation, corrections and additions welcome.
I have seen that there are several earlier posts that reference 178 Sqn in this forum but thought to put all lost a/c in the one post.
Halifax II - BB414 - 04/09/43.
Liberator - AL565 - 27/04/43 ; AL620 - 16/01/43 ; AL638 - 05/03/43 ; BZ891 - 19/11/43. THE 5th escapes me.
Liberator - AL630 - 27/04/44 ; BZ930 - 07/07/44 ; BZ932"Y" - 08/05/44 ; BZ948 - 19/03/44 ; EV812 - 19/03/44 ;
EV822 - 07/07/44 ; EV839"J" - 22/08/44 ; EV841"H" - 07/05/44 ; EV961 - 14/08/44 ; EV974"D" - 10/08/44 ;
EW106 - 11/10/44 ; EW140"K" - 11/05/44 ; EW160"E" - 28/08/44 ; EW264 - 15/08/44 ; EW275 - 15/08/44 ;
EW277 - 14/06/44 ; EW280 - 14/10/44 ; KG828"F" - 15/08/44 ; KG873 - 15/08/44 ; KG887 - 08/08/44;
KG933 - 17/08/44 ; KG934 - 13/09/44 ; KG938"A" - 21/08/44 ; KG942 - 05/10/44 ; KH100 - 06/11/44 ;
KH243 - 06/11/44. THE 27th a/c escapes me ?
Liberator - EW142 - 26/01/45 ; KG928 - 08/01/45 ; KH209 - 23/03/45 ; ( KH248 - 01/06/45 ; KL485 - 12/07/45 ?) or 2 other a/c ?
Alex ....Read More.||Alex Smart on 1st May 2018 11:31:41|