|410104 - Unaccounted airmen 4-1-1941||Colman*, Macrory and Mathews were killed on an intruder mission to Dieppe in Blenheim L6781**. Colman's body was washed ashore at Worthing. Others are on Runnymede
* Colman's initial is given as "V" by Warner
** Warner says "Serial No incorrect in several sources: L6781 was lost with 13 OTU 28.9.1940"
A ....Read More.||Amrit on 21st July 2008 10:42:26|
|410104 - Unaccounted airmen 4-1-1941||Thanks Amrit and Dick.
Perhaps Pel Temple has an answer for this tricky Blenheim serial L6781 !! (repaired after accident 28-9-1940 ?).
Henk. ....Read More.||Henk Welting on 21st July 2008 12:23:03|
|410104 - Unaccounted airmen 4-1-1941||Foreman has this Blenheim coded as YP-X - no serial, what is interesting is Aircraft of the few by Michael Bowyer has L6781 with 23 Sqn from 31-7-40 to ? ....Read More.||paulmcmillan on 22nd July 2008 05:37:10|
|410104 - Unaccounted airmen 4-1-1941||Hi Henk
An extract from my draft Volume I of 'Blue on Blue in WW"
"The first aerial misidentification of the New Year occurred on the night of 3/4 January, when 103 Squadron launched four Wellingtons from RAF Newton at 1630 to attack Bremen. On the return leg, Flt Lt L.M. Blome-Jones’ aircraft (N2770) was attacked from below by a night fighter when near the French coast. The assailant was seen approaching in a climbing turn and opened fire at 200 yards range. As it passed astern of the rear turret, Sgt Bedford opened fire with two bursts and noticed strikes on its fuselage, following which it dived through clouds and was not seen again. At this point the Wellington switched on its IFF since it was approaching the British coastline and was being coned by searchlights. In the absence of any report of loss or damage to a German night fighter, it seems likely that the attacking aircraft was Blenheim IF (L6781/YP-X) of 23 Squadron, piloted by 35-year-old Cornishman Sqn Ldr Cyril Colman, which failed to return from an intruder sortie. Colman and his crew – Flt Sgt David Mathews (on loan from 25 Squadron) and Sgt H.I. Macrory – were killed."
Hope this helps
Brian ....Read More.||brian on 23rd July 2008 05:23:35|
|23 Sqn - 3/4 Jan 1941||Hi All
According to Franks L6781 of 23 Sqn was lost on 3/4 Jan 1941. The pilot is listed as Sqn Ldr V G F Coleman and he was captured, the other two crew Flt Sgt D W Mathews and Sgt H I MacRory were killed.
CWGC shows Mathews and MacRory as being killed on the 3 Jan 1941, so far so good.
However, CWGC also shows a Sqn Ldr Coleman being killed or dying on 4 Jan 1941, at first sight I thoughht the pilot pilot may have died the following day, but the Coleman on CWGC is C H A Coleman and he his buried in Tangmere graveyard, so clearly not captured.
Did 23 Sqn have two flight commanders called Coleman at the same time, who also were lost or died within a day of each other?
Can anyone clarify this?
Malcolm ....Read More.||malcolm_raf on 24th February 2009 02:35:00|
|23 Sqn - 3/4 Jan 1941||Hi Malcolm
Warner's Blenheim has this one on 3/4-01-41 lost on an Intruder op to Dieppe.He records the crew as KIA and the surnames as you have them. The pilot is named as S/Ldr V Coleman and his body was washed ashore at Worthing,(Hence the UK burial). The recovery of the body and the night operation may explain the slight difference in the dates. One other thing he records is doubt about the serial which he says is incorrect in several sources.He has L6781 as DBF at Weston on the Green with no injuries on 28/9/1940 in a t/o accident.
Edit- Paul's info must increase the possibility of 2 Colemans with one becoming POW and the other being killed at around the same time but only ,perhaps , one of them from 23 Sqn
My Warner is the 2nd edition
Dick ....Read More.||Dick on 24th February 2009 02:51:03|
|410104 - Unaccounted airmen 4-1-1941||Brian, Coll, Dick.
I´ve the crew - Colman, Mathews, Macrory - still listed under a temporary Blenheim serial number Y0002. Some info say L6781 however Chorley and Air Britain have this serial being lost 28.9.1940 with 13 OTU.
Henk. ....Read More.||Henk Welting on 19th December 2009 10:58:15|
|Y0002 Blenheim 23 Sqn 3/4-1-1941 "L6781"||Hello,
This one is a little puzzling.
Blenheim I - 23 Sqdn "YP-X" - 3/4-1-1941
Sqdn/Ldr COLMAN, Cyril H. A. - 24058 RAF
F/Sgt MATHEWS, David W. - 561312 - RAF
Sgt MacRORY, Harry I. - 801456 - RAF
The a/c serial number is thought to have been L6781.
But this a/c was involved in an earlier accident on 28/09/1940 with 13 OTU, F/O P.D.SHARP escaped uninjured. The a/c caught fire on impact. ( See BCL vol 7 p30 ) & ( RÀF Aircraft L1000-N9999 ) which gives -
L6781 - 245/23/13 OTU - Swung on t/o and hit trees, Weston-on-the-Green 28.9.40, DBF.
So was the a/c recovered and repaired and returned to service ?
Are there details/documents to support the reserection ?
Alex ....Read More.||Alex Smart on 14th May 2017 09:30:29|
|Y0002 Blenheim 23 Sqn 3/4-1-1941 "L6781"||No solution but just more confusion.
F1180 for incident on 28/09/40 lists as L6181, Blenheim IV, Airframe Cat W (Amended E1), Engines R, Fire on Impact.
L6181 was Botha and L6781 was built as MkI.
F1180 amendment to Cat E1 and possibly addition of V to Blenheim IV dates the change from W to E.1 as circa 1941 but no other corrections or changes were made to the card.
Reading between the lines I suspect that the incident in 1940 was to L6781 and that the fire on impact was not extensive (hence recoverable engines). Initially recorded as Cat W it was later recatted and reworked as an AI airframe and returned to service.
Ross ....Read More.||Ross_McNeill on 14th May 2017 10:19:56|