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Thread: 590290 Sgt F Sumner, DFM

  1. #1
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    Default 590290 Sgt F Sumner, DFM

    Hello All,
    We are having some difficulty with this airman. He was a Sgt Pilot and got an AFM for numerous very difficult meteorological flights. There is a photo accompanying the sale of his medals at Spinks which shows him dressed (probably) as an Officer (i.e. no discernable NCO chevrons, or WO Insignia, but a Pilot's brevet). 590290 seems to indicate Enlistment in 1925 as an Apprentice Clerk in Oct 1925!! 590290 comes back with nothing on the LG (as does 'F. Sumner', or 'F Sumner'). If 590290 is an Officer number then why do Spinks quote that with his rank given as Sgt?
    We are not happy with this. Can anybody tell us which Unit he got the AFM from, and what became of him if, indeed, he was subsequently Commissioned. Most grateful for any help!
    TIA
    Peter Davies
    Meteorology is a science; good meteorology is an art!
    We might not know - but we might know who does!

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    The enlistment number indicates that he was among a batch of people whose numbers were allocated starting in Oct 1925, it does not imply that

    590001 to 594261 Oct 1925 Apprentice Clerks
    4260 Apprentice cleraks were taken in that month.

    There are other nearby numbers on CWGC 590275 and 77 and one in the 59029x range, check using geoff's search engine leaving out the last two digits. The first two were aged 27 at time of deaths early in th war.

    Have you tried the LG indexes it might be handier than searching for a common name.
    Dennis Burke
    - Dublin

    Foreign Aircrew and Aircraft Ireland 1939-1945
    www.ww2irishaviation.com

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    Strange quirke of fate but the next two NCO number can be found in LG!

    590291 Geoflrey William RYMER (52359). Comm'd in ADMINISTRATIVE 'AND SPECIAL DUTIES BRANCH. in July 1943.
    590292 Ronald James SAUNDERS (58274). Commishion in Equipment Branch in Aug 1946 from W/O
    Dennis Burke
    - Dublin

    Foreign Aircrew and Aircraft Ireland 1939-1945
    www.ww2irishaviation.com

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    The Battle of Britain Pilot and Ace 590289 (W/C) Sgt G.C Unwin D.F.M & Bar. Enlisted Apprentice Clerk April 1929 !

    Mark

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    His name according to honour the Airforces was Sgt Francis Summer he got AFm in 1941

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    http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/35203/pages/3682

    Francis Sumner !! typo in book

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    commissioned number 45840

    retired at Flt Lt 1957 but he never has AFM listed in Gazette and I can't find his award yet

    found it
    http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/35204/supplements/3752


    Typo in his name in Gazette icwonder if that is why his AFM was never listed subsequently
    Last edited by paulmcmillan; 6th September 2011 at 21:32.

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    Many thanks to all who have provided info on this man.
    I put '590290' into the LG search and it came back with nothing. I've taken some of the LG refs (above) and copied/pasted into my search engine. Lo, and behold, there is '590290' as bold as brass - and the page script (as displayed) does not seem to have any blemishes in/on the figures that might have led the OCR astray.
    Is this usual? Or am I doing something wrong? Or does the LG feel 'grumpy' on some days?
    TIA
    Peter Davies
    Meteorology is a science; good meteorology is an art!
    We might not know - but we might know who does!

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    I think it's the LG, I've had plenty where 0 in a service number is interpretted by their search engine as O.

    Some of the 'cleverer' search engines seem to also check variables on numbers just incase. For instance running a search for a date in ##-##-#### format in google will give things listed as ##th Month Year.

    However, as you say the text alternative returned by the LG search for Francis Sumner shows the service number as a number, not a mix of numbers and letters but it still won't return a search for his NCO service number.
    Alan Clark

    Peak District Air Accident Research

    http://www.peakdistrictaircrashes.co.uk/

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    It's my turn on KP tonight. I'm just about to depart to serve the evening meal. Your post has made me feel a whole lot better - i.e. it ain't entirely me that's wrong!!
    Tks, Rgds
    Peter Davies
    Meteorology is a science; good meteorology is an art!
    We might not know - but we might know who does!

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