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Thread: Battle L5235

  1. #11
    Bart FM Droog Guest

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    Hello Dick,

    Via the CWGC Database I searched the Runnymede Memorial. I registered all RAF personnel deceased or missing from 10/05/1940 - 30/06/1940.

    If you look at the men who died from 13/05/1940 until 21/05/1940 whose unit is yet unknown to me (see: <a href='http://www.epibreren.com/ww2/raf/unit_unknown.html#1305'>unit unknown, 13/05/1940</a>) you'll see it's highly unlikely that they could have been crew members of those mysterious five Battles of 218 Squadron.

    I think Henk Welting will know to which units the men I found belonged (have to ask him in the near future), but I guess he will agree to the unlikelihood of them being in the Battles.

    My theories regarding what could have happened:

    1. Somebody made a mistake and listed 10 instead of 5 planes lost.
    2. The 5 planes were damaged and left behind as the squadron withdrew from its base.
    3. The crews of the 5 planes were taken POW
    4. The crews of the 5 planes died of wounds, after 30/06/1940
    5: ?

    When I look at the losses of 218 Squadron before 14/05/1940 I count at least 7 planes lost. Looking at the <a href='http://france1940.free.fr/uk/raf_may.html'>RAF order of Battle 10 May 1940</a>, on which 218 Squadron is listed as '208' (which was a Lysander Squadron based in the Middle east) with 16 Battles.

    So on 14/05/1940 the Squadron would have had 9 Battles left (plus maybe a few extra as reinforcements). Which means that the number of 11 Battles sent out on 14/05/1940 could be right. But is it right?

    Regards,

    Bart

  2. #12
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    Steve - thanks for the hand written notes from NA.

    Dick - e-mail conection is successfuly continuing. New six colour profiles of downed Battles for Revi magazine are in course of semi-finished, and will be finished within next few weeks.

    Bart - I incline too to a theory that of 11 Battles sent out to attack "only" five were s/d over target area and six returned with major / minor problems to home base at Auberive sur Suippes. Five of them badly damaged and inreparable just in time there. The base was left only a few hours after Battles of the 218 Sqn returned from a slaughter over Sedan. I have no problem to understand official papers etc. were destroyed due to retreat from France and it could bring problem in accounting but it is hard to my understanding that if 10 a/c was s/d over target there is no acocunting for five crew with a possibility some of them were KIA or MIA, no photo source etc. I repeat - only my theory, but with detailed view on events and conjunctions.

    Happy Easter,
    Michal

  3. #13
    Bart FM Droog Guest

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    Hello Michal,

    Yes, 'a theory that of 11 Battles sent out to attack "only" five were s/d over target area and six returned with major / minor problems to home base at Auberive sur Suippes. Five of them badly damaged and irreparable just in time there' seems to be the most logical explanation.

    Regards,

    Bart

  4. #14
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    Taken from the 218 (B) Squadron ORB is a list of pilots on the squadron April 1940.

    C/O Wing Commander L.B Duggan

    S/Ldr Gillman

    F/Lt Rogers, Sanders, Crews, Daish

    F/O Hughes, Newton, Crane, Hudson, Shaw, Hulbert, Waring, Freeman, Foster.

    P/O Meek, Smith, Imrie, Murrey, Harris, Bazelgette, Buttery.

    F/Sgt Fleet, Marchand

    Sgt Horner, Dockerill, Owen, Preston.


    On June 5th the squadron role was, 10 officers, 39 NCO.


    Lost of Squadron pilots, 1st July 1940, no NCO given.

    F/Lt Hughes, Sanders

    F/O Richmond, Newton, Shaw,

    P/O Smith, Anstey, Mitchell, Turnball, Wheelwright, Agar, Crosse, Johnson, Meek.


    Again taken via ORB.

    Regards

    Steve
    No.218 (Gold Coast) Squadron Association Historian
    No.623 squadron Research

    ~~IN TIME ~~

  5. #15
    Bart FM Droog Guest

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    Hello Steve,

    From the above in April listed <a href='http://www.epibreren.com/ww2/raf/218_squadron.html'>218 Sqdn</a> pilots:

    F/O C.A.R. Crews PoW, 11/05/1940
    F/O A.J. Hudson PoW, 11/05/1940
    Flying Officer (Pilot) John F.R. Crane, KIA 14/05/1940

    Pilot Officer (Pilot) Frederick S. Bazalgette, KIA 12/05/1940
    P/O A.M. Imrie, PoW, 14/05/1940
    P/O W.A.R. Harris, Injured 14/05/1940 - safe
    Pilot Officer Robert T.L. Buttery, missing 14/05/1940

    Flight Sergeant (Pilot) John B. Horner, KIA 12/05/1940

    Sergeant (Pilot) Charles J.E. Dockrill, KIA 11/05/1940

    and (not listed as pilot in April):

    P/O H.M. Murray PoW, 11/05/1940
    F/O (Pilot) D.A.J. Foster PoW, 14/04/1940

    To complicate it further:

    16/05/1940: transfer. Two of the Battle squadrons, Nos. 105 and 218, had only four aircraft left between them; these and the surviving crews were transferred to the other Battle squadrons.

    Regards,

    Bart

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