Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 21

Thread: Halifax MZ289

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    38
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    If I am informed properly, the Aaldonk crashsite refers to a CG 4A glider.
    All I have is the following:

    Aaldonk near Ven/Zelderheide [Gennep area], pilot 1/Lt. O. V. Dziewialtowski, "chalk 41/60" (detail on location resp. mission??).

    Regards, George

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default maybe I can help

    Hello Bill and others.
    First let me introduce myself; I'm Frank 24 years old living in Eindhoven NL. My parents live in Milsbeek (the place where G.S. Reading is burried at the War Cemetery). I was researching the subject about a year ago, and this way already came in contact with Paul (whitehalifax) who also replied on this topic. (Hi Paul!)

    There are several people in Milsbeek/Gennep/Ottersum that confirmed the crash of the Halifax Bomber according to Paul, who spoke some people a few years ago. There is also someone living in Gennep who actually saw the plane coming down over his parent's farm, as a small boy. I tried to contact him, but I haven't been in the area for a few months.
    There is even a small memorial sign on a tree next to the crash site, left by the Aitchison familiy who visited the crash site a few years ago. I have a picture of it, I will soon try to post it on this forum topic.

    I have as hobby metal-detecting, and will try to get permission to check the crash site out in the near future. So maybe in this way I can help.

    About the strange 'Lost over Northsea' statement I have an opnion: I think Bill can confirm that the plane/crew was part of the Market Garden missions. Radio contact was already broken on the way over the Northsea, but I think they just carried on since there was nothing seriously damaged. When arriving near the dropzones of Groesbeek they were shot down by german FLAK cannons (maybe situated in the Gennep/ Oeffelt or Boxmeer area) and crashed at the crashsite near Ottersum/VenZelderheide.
    But what happend to the crew? This is a serious question since there is nothing documented about this, only that G.S. Reading is burried in Milsbeek.

    A possible theory: the crashsite is really close to the Reichswald / Siegfried Line german defences. So possibly the germans covered everything up and tried to gather information etc. But this is just a theory.

    I hope someday the truth about the crash will be found out, and I am willing to help.
    Last edited by Frankieo; 21st October 2008 at 15:03.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    As promissed, the pictures of the memorial sign near the crash site.
    http://www.frankieo.nl/raf/DCIM0005klein.JPG
    http://www.frankieo.nl/raf/PlaatjeKlein.jpg

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    317
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    I can confirm that there are no unknown Allied airmen buried in Milsbeek. Jonkerbos holds 17 of such graves, of which 4 have non-matching dates, and 13 are undated. Reichswald holds 66 graves of unknown Allied airmen. 36 with dates on the headstones, none matching, and 30 without dates. The closest match would be four unknown Allied airmen, one identified as RAF, none identified to rank, all dated 06-10-1944. As yet it is unclear if this is the date of burial or the date of death.

    Regards,

    Rob

  5. #15
    whitehalifax Guest

    Default

    Hi Guys , Sorry for not replying to your threads but Iam a serving soldier and been away on Operations overseas .
    Ok , I spoke toan eyewitness who was the son of the farmer who owned the field where the aircraft crashed , he stated that the Halifax ( Quote = 4 engined bomber ) was hit and coming down , behind his farmhouse was a German Flak gun , this Gun opened up on the Halifax at very low altitude , suddenly the plane dropped into the field . Reader was the only body found or seen . All the while there was fighting going on around the area with the Americans as part of Operation Market Garden . The American pilots that have been mistaken for Reader were from the Field Artillery HQ Section . 1 was Lt Meyers from New York the other I cant remember but they are Buried and if I remember rightly in an American cemetery in Belgium and 1 in the US . The Farmer was told by the Germans after the fighting that if they went near the wreckage they would be shot , Reader was laid out in the farmhouse / yard for 3 days after that he said he couldnt say . When the area was evacuated and the locals taken away by the Germans til the liberation of Holland the wreck was still there , the allies were the ones who cleared the wreckage . If the rest of the crew were still there then they must have been seen and buried , if they were not there then what happened to them ? Also Readers wife received a letter confirming his death by the CWGC , they must have had some ID from the body to say it was him and he was Australian , Reader was the only Australian airman to Be killed that day through out trhe European Theatre of war.
    The plaque from the Aitchison Family was put up after my visit and after I consulted with them . I made another visit with Readers Family from Perth Australia in 2004 . I did a field walk of the crash site and found many bits of airframe with numbers on them , I showed my local aircraft museum and they said that in their opinion they were from a Halifax Bomber . I have been to most of the cemeteries in Holland and Germany but there are no graves that link up to this crash .
    My aim was and is to try and find the Grave of my uncle for my late father the younger brother of this crew member before my father died , unfortunatley I never could do this as my Father died not long after my research started . Strange though that my father was a paratrooper ( like me ) and was fighting in Arnhem during Operation market Garden , not that far from the crash site , he last saw his brother in 1941 , strange to think that his brother was killed around 20miles or so from where he was fighting and he never knew he was so close .
    Thanks for the replies and I look forward to reading more .

    Paul .
    Last edited by whitehalifax; 4th February 2009 at 13:56.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    559
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default

    While checking the Runnymede Memorial for the missing, I see F/Sgt G.S Reader is listed on Panel 261.

    As he is now buried in Milsbeek, it could mean his body was identified after the Runnymede Mem was finished in 1952.

    Or maybe his body was discovered some time after 1952 ?

    Mark
    Last edited by Marks; 2nd January 2011 at 17:06. Reason: error

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    3
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    2 new things from my side:

    - I found some very little video footage filmed from near the village of Gennep, which shows large smoke clouds coming from he area of where the plane has crashed, ofcourse on the same day. And several people confirmed this was indeed the plane in the Aaldonk we are talking about here. 3 pictures from this movie:
    https://dl.dropbox.com/s/tmxx5r2scgsfya9/ScreenShot1.jpg
    https://dl.dropbox.com/s/tmxx5r2scgsfya9/ScreenShot2.jpg
    https://dl.dropbox.com/s/tmxx5r2scgsfya9/ScreenShot3.jpg


    -After talking to some people here in Holland that investigate chrashes of allied airplanes in Holland and this area in particular, they state that the plane that came down in the Aaldonk on that day was a C-47 and not a Halifax!
    They also state that the Halifax that was lost over the Northsea, was also crashed in the Northsea while on a trailing mission. And could never end up in the Aaldonk area where at that time where only C-47 planes bringing gliders and troops to the landing zones at Groesbeek.
    !

    This is really an extraordinary case, and to be honest I don't know which story is the true story anymore.

    Frank

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default I think I may have some thing you will want to see

    OK everyone, I am really hoping that the two people connected to this thread get notification of my post, if they don't contact me within a week or so I may write to them seperatly....

    Because... I do believe that I may have a crew photo.. well actually SEVERAL crew photo's of this plane.

    They have been sent to me by the widow a ground crew member of 102 squadron for our new web site.

    The link to the page is here:
    http://www.102ceylonsquadron.co.uk/memKennethKiddell.html

    Paul, Bill by all means copy the pics off the web page, if you want me to email you them I can do... but please if you think these are the crew that went down could you please let us know?

    We have no idea when these were taken or who is in them other than Ken Kiddell.

    If these photo's are of use to either of you after all this time I would love to be able to phone Ken's wife and let her know.

    All the best

    Chris

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Aaldonk near Ven/Zelderheide [Gennep area], pilot 1/Lt. O. V. Dziewialtowski

    The glider that crashed in this area was piloted by my uncle; 1/Lt. Otgut. V. Dziewialtowski, 316th TCG, 36th TCS. As I read this thread several questions and comments come to mind. First I am curious about the previously cited chalk number of his flight as to where that information comes from? I also see the mention here of a 1/Lt. Meyer who was an occupant on my uncles glider. 1/Lt. Emil Meyer was a member of Headquarters Battery, 320th Glider field Artillery Battalion, 82 Airborne Division. There also was another occupant of the glider PFC Ernest Blanton who was in the same unit as 1/Lt. Meyer. All three perished in the crash. The glider was seen out of control and on fire passing through three hundred feet of altitude. Other information indicates it landing near or on a wall. They were MIA for several year. They had been ordered buried locally by a German officer and their grave was marked mistakenly as identifying them as "Three English Fliers". I am always seeking more information about my uncle and the exact location of the crash and burial. Additional information is that his glider was towed in the 18th of September, 1944 by a C-47, 43-30652 piloted by Major Bertie W. Davis. 43-30652 is still flying and is owned by 1941 Historical Aircraft Group Museum, Geneseo, New York. My uncle's glider number was 43-40042.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    30
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hello Paul
    I am researching Sgt Gordon Valentine Greening, air gunner, crew member on MZ289. Do you have any information you could share. Gordon is named on a local war memorial (Pontlottyn) which I am researching for a local historical society. I would appreciate any help.
    Regards, Roy

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •