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Thread: Missing Hudson, 6 September 1942

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    Default Missing Hudson, 6 September 1942

    Similiar to a previous post of mine, I am seeking likely a contender for a missing Hudson around Wales on 6 September 1942.

    Based at Llanbedr at the time, 41 Squadron's ORB reports that, at 09:00, a message was received that a Hudson bomber was reported missing. Two pilots were sent up to conduct a search, but returned within an hour having seen nothing.

    Unfortunately, there is no indication of the area of the search, but was a loss in/off Wales reported that day? Can anyone suggest a likely candidate, please?

    Thanks
    Steve
    41 (F) Squadron RAF at War and Peace, April 1916-March 1946
    http://brew.clients.ch/41sqnraf.htm

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    Steve,

    Hudson N7325 of 1 (C)OTU - 5/6-9-1942 - bad weather conditions - hit hill - Wildboar Scar above Crowdundle Beck near Appleby-in-Westmorland (do hope this is correct) - time 00.30h. Crew killed:
    F/O P.A. Bourke - 116160 * Sgt J. Bumpstead - 1017138 * Sgt L.T. Griffin - 1380956 * Sgt R. Band - 1376686 * Sgt R.W. Hewett - 1380777.

    Regards,
    Henk.

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    Steve, Henk,
    Beaufighter VI X8261 from 456 Sqn. also searched for a missing Hudson from 06.25 to 07.50 hrs. reported in the sea north of the Skerries (The Skerries Rocks??) nothing seen.
    HTH
    Tony K

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    The aircraft's route was a round trip within the Irish Sea, there was quite a long entry in the ORB.

    September 6th 1942, “Hudson aircraft B59 lost on night navigation trip, Base – South Rock – Kish Light Vessel – Skerries – Base. The last radio contact with this aircraft was at 0030 hrs when it called Station Signals “Any message for me?”. Position was then 20 mls South of South Rock. At 0515 hrs Air Sea Rescue was instituted through 15 Group, who arranged for aircraft from Valley and Andreas to search the Irish Sea, and for a broadcast to be made to all shipping in the area. At 0817 and 0823 Anson aircraft left Silloth to fly over the course. Returning at 1127 and 1150 these aircraft had nothing to report. Aircraft from Valley and Andreas and 82 Group also had nothing to report. At 1234 hrs Hudson aircraft B69 left to carry out search of Cardigan Bay, but returned at 1800 hrs, having located nothing. It is therefore assumed that aircraft B59 and crew, Pilot, P/O Bourke, Sgts Bumpstead, Band, Hewettt and Griffin of No.32 Course are lost.”

    September 7th 1942, “The bodies of Sgts Sage, Can.R105629, Anderson Can.R92541 and
    Derbyshire, Can.R102185 were recovered from the sea at Scawfell. It was confirmed by the
    Penrith Police that Hudson aircraft N7325 (B59 of No.2 Squadron, lost on the 6th Sept) was
    found badly burnt, south of Cross Fell, North of Appleby. The crew of five were all dead.”

    I noted the fact that 1 OTU were not recording flights, eg A Flt, but Squadrons, that can be a little confusing at times.
    Alan Clark

    Peak District Air Accident Research

    http://www.peakdistrictaircrashes.co.uk/

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    Hi Henk, Tony and Alan

    Thanks for your responses.

    Tony, a 456 Sqdn. Beau on the same search would make sense as they were based at Valley, only 37m / 60km from Llanbedr, and was in the same Wing.

    Henk, my first assumption was that your suggestion was not the aircraft in question, as the distance from The Skerries to Crowdundle Beck in Cumbria is 120m / 193km, so 41 and 456 would have been searching a long way 'off course'. In fact, they were, as Alan's subsequent posting shows that it was indeed the same Hudson.

    Maybe I'm mis-reading something, though... Alan, yould you please explain the significance of "The bodies of Sgts Sage, Can.R105629, Anderson Can.R92541 and Derbyshire, Can.R102185 were recovered from the sea at Scawfell"? From other entries, they don't appear to be members of the same crew...?

    In any case, thanks Chaps, a full reply to my query; much appreciated.

    Thanks
    Steve
    Last edited by Steve Brew; 12th April 2008 at 15:06.
    41 (F) Squadron RAF at War and Peace, April 1916-March 1946
    http://brew.clients.ch/41sqnraf.htm

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    The bodies being washed up has nothing to do with the Hudson, I just cut and pasted the entry for that day from the ORB, they were from another aircraft lost during August 1942 and over the next few weeks a number of the crew were washed ashore.
    Alan Clark

    Peak District Air Accident Research

    http://www.peakdistrictaircrashes.co.uk/

  7. #7
    Scarletspitfire Guest

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    The dates given by the CWGC for Sage & Derbyshire is the 4th September 1942. I believe that the Anderson recorded at the time may be the man shown below, whose death is recorded as the 7th September 1942. He is the only member of the RCAF to be killed between the 3rd and 10th September 1942 whose details are close to those of the man you have shown.

    Hope these details help.

    Regards

    Paul J

    SAGE, WILLIAM BRUCE Flight Sergeant (Pilot) R/105629
    04/09/1942 Canadian
    Royal Canadian Air Force Age:19
    Sec. S. Grave 19. SILLOTH (CAUSEWAYHEAD) CEMETERY, HOLME LOW
    Son of William Godfrey and Sadie Violenta Sage, of Lacombe, Alberta, Canada.

    DERBYSHIRE, GEORGE EDWARD Flight Sergeant (Nav.) R/102185
    04/09/1942 Canadian
    Royal Canadian Air Force Age: 33
    Sec. S. Grave 17. SILLOTH (CAUSEWAYHEAD) CEMETERY, HOLME LOW
    Son of George Herbert and Elsie Annie Derbyshire; husband of Thelma Marguerite Derbyshire, of Willows, Saskatchewan, Canada.

    ANDREW, FREDERICK NORMAN Sergeant (Pilot) R/90241
    07/09/1942 7 Advanced Flying Unit
    Royal Canadian Air Force Age:23
    Sec. R. Grave 27. SUTTON BRIDGE (ST. MATTHEW) CHURCHYARD
    Son of David and Annie Andrew, of Burgessville, Ontario, Canada.
    Last edited by Scarletspitfire; 13th April 2008 at 06:13. Reason: Information Update

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    Sage and Derbyshire were from No.25 OTU and were killed when their Wellington DV600 was abandoned to crash near Keswick.

    Chorley OTU Losses

    Regards
    Ross

  9. #9
    Scarletspitfire Guest

    Default A Lesson Learnt

    Ross,

    Apologies. This is my first post on this Forum and I was clearly a bit over eager to get involved. As you pointed out, Derbyshire & Sage were from 25 OTU. I have now also found James Anderson of the same unit.

    I'll try to keep my enthusiasm under control in future, as accuracy is vital in these matters.

    Regards

    Paul J

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    Hi Alan, Paul and Ross

    Thanks for your posts.

    Alan - Thanks for your clarification.

    Paul - Yes, accuracy is imperative, and it is forumites' eagerness to achieve this in whatever they are researching that makes this forum so good. There are many different types of people who are regulars on the forum. Some are authors (such as Ross), others are researching for a potential book, others for their websites, and yet others for personal reasons. I think it would be fair to say that all of them are driven by their enthusiasm to tell as accurate a story as is possible today. The geographical reach of the forum means that opinion and fact can be - and is - obtained from any part of the world. Enthusiasm for your subject of interest is always a good thing. Accuracy is vital, but don't "keep my enthusiasm under control in future" - that's what this forum is all about!

    Cheers
    Steve
    41 (F) Squadron RAF at War and Peace, April 1916-March 1946
    http://brew.clients.ch/41sqnraf.htm

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