Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 12

Thread: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Shepperton
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Hi all

    I know questions about these have arisen on here from time to time, but just wanted to share that my latest projects (work very much still in progress) have been to try to compile details of the above from files up at Kew.

    The first one is far from comprehensive (I don't propose to cover the thousands of individual targets that were catalogued, but have got several hundred so far), while the second (the 'fish' codes list) is from an 8 Group file.

    If anyone has any queries I'm happy to see if I can help, but as I've said I've still got some way to go with the 1940 ones and haven't yet found or properly checked any files giving details for bomb targets in France, Belgium or the Netherlands at that time.

    Ian

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Location
    Biggin Hill
    Posts
    12
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Ian,

    Very interesting - have a look here, there may be some that you may not have. This was compiled from entries in Bomber Command ORBs and also from the appendices to the AHB narrative "The RAF in the Bombing Offensive Against Germany Vol II Restricted Bombing Sep 1939-May 1941". Incidentally, Appendix V of the narrative lists a large number of early "Fish" Codes.
    Last edited by Andy Mitchell; 13th November 2022 at 13:33. Reason: additional comment
    Best Regards
    Andy Mitchell
    www.luftwaffedata.co.uk


  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Lions Bay, BC
    Posts
    801
    Thanks
    37
    Thanked 51 Times in 44 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Very interesting Ian. I would like to see what you have compiled. I have a single mimeographed page of the Fish Codes. Some of the others (oil targets and other smaller targets) are coded with a letter number system. The Form Bs always refer to codes but he Bomber Command raid reports indicate a location I believe.

    I have a few questions:

    1) Is there a system to the naming using letters and numbers?

    2) are Geographical coordinates assigned to these?

    Jim

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Shepperton
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Hi Andy

    Thanks for that link. I've got some of those but the 'A' group of targets is one that I'm still working on, with lots of gaps still to fill. As you can see, that list that you referred to contains loads of gaps. There's also a few errors on that list and some of the descriptions are quite condensed. On my listing I'm trying to include a little bit more detail.

    The 'A' group of targets was only one of the categories too. It seems that there were different categories for most letters of the alphabet!

    Thanks again though for the extra info.

    Ian

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Shepperton
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Hi Jim

    I've just emailed you a copy of my list of the 'fish-coded' towns - 100 of them listed. These are from an 8 Group file at Kew.

    Those codes are simple fish names per town or city. The individual targets therein must have been more-specifically defined separately. This list is therefore unlike the 1940 target codes list (which did use letters and numbers, eg A.5, D.75, M.433 etc) which works from the individual targets and then groups them into categories by type.

    Kind regards

    Ian
    Last edited by ianh; 13th November 2022 at 23:11.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Lions Bay, BC
    Posts
    801
    Thanks
    37
    Thanked 51 Times in 44 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    I am working on a list of "Non-Fish" Target Codes. These for some dates in March. Source: AIR 14/3133 Form "B" for March 1-15, 1945. It's messy and needs proofing, but this is what I have so far. Note that major cities during this period were still coded with fish names.

    Code Target Date Comment
    GQ.1625 Misburg 15-Mar-45
    GQ.1531 Rauxel Tar Plant 15-Mar-45
    GQ.1536 Mathias Stinnes Benzol 15-Mar-45
    Not Given Arnsberg Viaduct 15-Mar-45
    4907E/19 Zweibrucken 14-Mar-45 Enemy Armour and Troups
    4907E/18 Homberg 14-Mar-45 Enemy Armour and Troups
    GH.501 Bielefeld 14-Mar-45
    GH.504 Arnsberg Viaduct 14-Mar-45
    GQ.1512 Lutzkendorf synthetic oil 14-Mar-45
    GH.570 Erin 13-Mar-45
    GH.555 Dahlbusch 13-Mar-45
    GH.691 Emscher Middlebrook has these two 3 Group targets as Datteln and Hattingen near Bochum
    GF.2234 Heinrichschutte
    GQ.1512
    GY.4761 Hamburg Blohm & Voss Shipyards 08-Mar-45
    GQ.1644 Heide (oil) 07-Mar-45 Heide GPI Method. GPI Run from a bearing and distance on coastline
    GQ.1633 Harburg (oil) A & B 07-Mar-45
    5106E/9 Wesel 06-Mar-45 3-Group
    GH.329 Sassintz 06-Mar-45 5-Group
    GQ.1615 Salzbergen 06-Mar-45 3-Group
    GQ.1514 Bohlen 05-Mar-45 5-Group

    These for 29-December-1944
    GQ.1637 Scholven Buer 29-Dec-44
    GH.612A Troisdorf Marshalling Yards Bonn 29-Dec-44
    Last edited by JDCAVE; 14th November 2022 at 08:05.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Shepperton
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Hi Jim

    While mine (the 8 Group 'fish-codes' list) was laid out slightly differently from your one (maybe with a few extra notes in the 8 Gp one), it seems to be basically the same as the version you've sent me. So that seems pretty straightforward.

    But your other note (above) is VERY interesting! A lot of those 1944/45 'G'-codes (not all, mind you) match the ones that I'm starting to compile from the 1940 targets listings! I hadn't realised that the '1940 codes' continued to be used up until the end of the war. You learn something every day!!

    Think I'm going to have to do quite a bit more work on filling in the gaps in my stuff to make it as comprehensive a list as I can!

    Thanks again

    Ian

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    133
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Ian and Jim,
    Might be worth getting hold of a copy of 'Operational Numbers of Bomb Targets in Germany' published by Naval and Military Press, a reprint of an Air Ministry document dated September/October 1940. Gives a lot, if not all, the 'G' codes and Air Ministry numbers but not the older 'A', 'B', 'C' codes.
    Regards.
    Mark
    Last edited by MSIMPSON; 14th November 2022 at 12:49.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Lions Bay, BC
    Posts
    801
    Thanks
    37
    Thanked 51 Times in 44 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    I wonder if these represent some sort of grid reference for various large scale maps.

    Jim

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Shepperton
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default Re: BC Target Codes 1940 and Target 'Fish' Codes 1943-45

    Quote Originally Posted by JDCAVE View Post
    I wonder if these represent some sort of grid reference for various large scale maps.

    Jim
    They dont. They were all prefixed G- with the second letter representing the category or sub-category (type) of target: GO-, GR-, GU-, etc. Under those prefixes they were then just listed numerically, not geographically or by map reference.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •