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Thread: 4 FTS Abu Sueir

  1. #1
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    Default 4 FTS Abu Sueir

    Does anyone have a list of casualties sustained in flying accidents at 4 FTS Abu Sueir between June 1937 and November 1937?

    Regards,
    Simon

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    Simon,

    From The Times and Flight

    10 September P/O George 'Lofty' Fraser was killed at Abu Sueir.

    Do you have the accident for 20 January?

    LA/C Harold Norris (pilot) survived an accident at Kantara, but his passenger A/C1 Stanley Harvey was killed. (Same sources)

    Any help?

    Brian

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    Not Casualties I have some incidents

    17-Jun-37 AUDAX K7537 of 4FTS crashed on overshoot, Abu Sueir.
    18-Aug-37 HART TRAINER K5051 of 4FTS crashed on landing on Abu Sueir range.
    24-Aug-37 HART TRAINER K4903 of 4FTS crashed on landing, Abu Sueir.
    10-Sep-37 AUDAX K3715 of 4FTS spun into ground in circuit, Abu Sueir. - Acting P/O George Lofty Fraser (Lofty was his real middle name!)
    03-Jan-38 AUDAX K7509 of 4FTS crashed on landing, Jif Jaffa, Sinai.
    12-Jan-38 AUDAX K7510 of 4FTS crashed in forced landing, Abu Sueir.

    LA/C Harold Norris (pilot) survived an accident at Kantara, but his passenger A/C1 Stanley Harvey was killed. (Same sources)

    was this one:
    20-Jan-37 AUDAX K5232 of 4FTS broke up in air nr Kantara, Egypt.


    do you have a name ?????
    Last edited by paulmcmillan; 29th November 2013 at 09:48.

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    Hello Simon,

    You could run a check on the Flightglobal web site. Type in flying accidents into search box with year 1937 to 1937. This brings up many accidents but I have not gone thro them to check location(s)

    Regards,

    Ian

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    From the ORB:
    17 June 1937 - Act Pilot Officer R H Rice was thrown from the rear cockpit of a Gordon aircraft and killed.
    10 September 1937 - Act Pilot Officer GL Fraser was killed in a flying accident at Adu Sueir village.

    No further details on either incident.

    HTH
    Andy

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    Hi All,

    Thanks for all the responses.

    Basically I have a twofold area of investigation in regards to 4 FTS.

    Firstly, I am trying to identify an airman who I have several photos of and in them all he is named as 'VERNOR'. Whether this is a nickname, surname etc I know not. One of the photos has been marked with a "+ RIP" and the photo of is Vernor stood in the desert in flying gear.

    Secondly, I am trying to understand why an airman, Sgt William Gair, who has been recommended for flying training, subsequently posted to 4 FTS in June 1937, would complete over 60 hours of flying as a pilot and then in November 1937 have it noted in his service record 'Provisionally withdrawn from flying training and remustered to basic trade of Fitter I'. What could have happened?

    The reason I believe Vernor could have died whilst at 4 FTS is that the photos show him travelling with Gair on board a ship to Egypt where Gair went on to 4 FTS.

    Hope this extra information may help.

    Simon

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    Simon,
    Two possibilities as to why Gair was withdrawn from flying training. He may have come down with some sickness, or been injured in an accident, or his progress in flying training may have been unsatisfactory in some way. In other words, his flying career may have been under some sort of a cloud at this time, and continuation of the (expensive) training was possibly under review. Being remustered to his basic trade suggests to me that his flying days were almost certainly over. In WW2, aircrew trainees in this position were more clearly annotated as "Flying training course terminated" (permanently or temporarily as the case may be).
    David D

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    Hi David.

    That was my thought as well. Within a year he was an Air Observers course in the UK which he passed and went on to have a successful career as an Observer then Navigator. Would there be any mention of the exact reason in any documentation written up at the time, 4 FTS records?

    Simon

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