Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18

Thread: RCAF WAG badge - different type

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Posts
    3,772
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 31 Times in 30 Posts

    Default RCAF WAG badge - different type

    Hi all,

    I have recently find out that beyond the WAG brevet furnished with the crown on the top and letters RCAF at the bottom, there was also a plain variant withou both.
    It is new to me and I am able to find out both variants on the internet but did not find yet any explanation why there were two so different types?
    They comes from different period or there is another reason? I suppose the palin one is from period from second half of 1941 to first half of 1942.

    Any help much appreciated

    TIA

    Pavel
    Czechoslovak Airmen in the RAF 1940-1945
    http://cz-raf.webnode.cz

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    709
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default

    Hi Pavel,

    I have a sweetheart badge to Wag which has the Crown and RCAF which is made of sterling silver, I suspect itís a later version but thatís only a guess on my part.

    Cheers

    John.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Posts
    3,772
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 31 Times in 30 Posts

    Default

    Hi John, thanks for you comment.
    I am after info of the official embroided badge worn on uniform rather than the sweetheart brooch.

    Pavel
    Czechoslovak Airmen in the RAF 1940-1945
    http://cz-raf.webnode.cz

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    719
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hi Pavel ,

    I stand to be corrected on this but my understanding of these two different WAG Brevets is this , it was never an official RAF issue brevet it was used by the RCAF and commonwealth air crew who trained in Canada and possibly changed to a W/Op/AG of RAF pattern upon arrival back in the UK ?

    Rgs Phill Jones

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Posts
    3,772
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 31 Times in 30 Posts

    Default

    Hi Phil,
    thank you for your interesting comment. But I would thing if the badge has been approved oficially by the RCAF, it would be also accepted by the RAF. It seems to me quite strange that they would be exchanging the badge according to the territory of service. But sure - I have no prove for my opinion.

    Pavel
    Czechoslovak Airmen in the RAF 1940-1945
    http://cz-raf.webnode.cz

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    280
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 29 Times in 29 Posts

    Default

    The Canadian 'WAG' badge was definitely intensely disliked by the RAF Hierarchy,not sure why.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Posts
    3,772
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 31 Times in 30 Posts

    Default

    Thnaks for your cpomment bvs, it is quite interesting and I hear about this for the first time. Do you have any additional source you get this info from?

    TIA
    Pavel
    Czechoslovak Airmen in the RAF 1940-1945
    http://cz-raf.webnode.cz

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Wiltshire
    Posts
    2,526
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    Pavel,

    The following is based on Jefford's Observers and Navigators and other non-pilot aircrew in the RFC, RNAS and RAF (Airlife Publishing Ltd; 2001) which is the bible of the subject. As the title infers, it gives no consideration to the practices of Commonwealth air forces. Although the publication is extremely comprehensive and well referenced it is difficult for a non-specialist (like me) to properly follow all the meanderings of the history of aircrew badges. Consequently I apologise for any mistakes I've made.

    1. The Pilot brevet, or 'Wings', was introduced in 1913 and awarded to pilots on completion of their flying training, but in 1915 a half-brevet was authorised for non-pilot aircrew, consisting of a half wing attached to an 'O' - the design of the 'flying O' quickly acquired the sobriquet of 'the flying arsehole'. The 'O' indicated such men were qualified as Observers as that was their main role on reconnaissance flights. In practice the brevets were not made available until 1918.

    2. That was the situation until December 1939 when an Air Gunner brevet was authorised for gunners; similar in design to the Observer brevet, but with 'AG' replacing the 'O'. At the time wireless operators had to complete an air gunnery course and, as such, qualified for an AG brevet.

    3. By 1942 non-pilot aircrew roles were becoming increasing specialised and more brevets were authorised, all based on the Observer brevet:

    Navigator - N
    Air Bomber - B
    Wireless operator (Air Gunner) - AG (not WAG)
    Air Gunner - AG
    Flight Engineer - E

    4. In December 1943 the long-standing dual qualified WOp/AG trade was abolished leaving wireless operators concentrating on their primary role. Recognising this a new air crew badge was introduced with 'S' instead of AG, the 'S' standing for signals.

    5. I believe the only other air crew brevet that was introduced during the war was the 'M' brevet for Meteorological Air Observers in April 1945 - despite the MAO trade having been recognised in 1943.

    Hope this helps. Perhaps one of our Canadian colleagues could comment on the Canadian procedures.

    Brian
    Last edited by Lyffe; 4th March 2019 at 17:32.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Wiltshire
    Posts
    2,526
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts

    Default

    Further to my #8, during the early part of WW2 RCAF brevets were closely aligned to RAF brevets, but in March 1943 these were modified to incorporate the RCAF monogram (https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30061532). Examples can be seen at http://www.bcatp.org/077-rcaf-aircre...onality-titles, but there are some differences in that the RCAF appears to have introduced a 'WAG' but not a 'S' brevet.

    Brian

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    280
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 29 Times in 29 Posts

    Default

    This short extract is from the Jefford Book,looks like the 'Crownless' WAG badge version was unofficial and outlawed by the RCAF.
    Very sorry I do not have any sources,my comment was purely from memory - which may or may not be correct.

    rgds baz


  11. The Following User Says Thank You to bvs For This Useful Post:

    CZ_RAF (5th March 2019)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •