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Thread: Warren John Sandman RNZAF-401412

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    Default Warren John Sandman RNZAF-401412

    Hello there,
    Could anyone help me with where and when did Sandy Sandman train in NZ and the units please. He enlisted in June 1040 and after shipping to the UK went to 53 OTU at Heston on 13-3-41. Did he do his SFTS in Canada or in NZ.
    Any help appreciated, thanks.
    Roy

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    Sandman was enlisted at Levin as an Airman Pilot u/t on 4 Jun 40. He would have been there for about 6 weeks before being posted to an EFTS. He was from Auckland so it is very likely that this was 4EFTS at Whenuapai (pilot trainees tended to be posted to EFTS closest to their home town). He would then have gone to an FTS, either 1FTS at Wigram or 2FTS at Woodbourne, or perhaps 3FTS at Ohakea but this didn't open until October 1940. He embarked on the 'Empress of Russia' on 6 Jan 41 for the UK on attachment to the RAF.

    Errol

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    Hello Martyn,
    Many thanks for your information on WJ Sandman training in NZ. I had contacted Joss Leclercq about Sandman's WO344 POW Questionnaire, but he said he could not find it at Kew. In a website it stated Sandman was a POW at Stalag Luft Sagen, I assume this was Stalag Luft III at Sagan, It also gave he was at Balearia , I cannot find this POW camp.
    He probably went to Dulag Luft Oberusel, Frankfurt first to be processed and given POW Number 4379. Then to Stalag Luft III at Sagan. Any dates please.
    If anyone could add or correct, this I would be very grateful.
    Roy

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    Correction.
    The Stalag Luft III was at Sagan und Belaria. Thanks to Joss.

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    Hello Roy,

    You will find an interesting article mentioning Warren Sandman RNZAF, here:

    http://www.aifpow.com/Part-5-Other-E...ny_and_austria

    Use a "Control F" search on Sandman to find the mentions.

    He was one of the unfortunates incarcerated in Theresienstadt (Terezin), aka "The Little Fortress". There are a few annoying errors, but perservere.

    Col.
    Last edited by COL BRUGGY; 21st October 2016 at 15:11.

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    Warren John Sandman undertook his advanced training in New Zealand at No. 2 Flying Training School, Blenheim (Woodbourne), commencing ITS on 26/8/40, to ATS 28/10/40, passed out 20/2/40, having been awarded his flying badge w.e.f. 28/10/40. His commissioning date was 21/12/40. He was trained as a single-engine pilot (type trained on was Vickers Vincent/Vildebeest). Do not have full details of his EFTS training, but this almost certainly undertaken at Bell Block (New Plymouth) on DH 60 Moths, DH 82 Tiger moths, Miles Hawks. No. 4 EFTS at Whenuapai was not opened for business until December 1940, too late for the likes of Sandman who had already graduated FTS by this date. The flow of trainee RNZAF pilots in New Zealand during 1940 and up to about mid-1941 was that No. 1 EFTS (Taieri) passed all its trainees on to 1 FTS (Wigram), 2 EFTS passed all its trainees on to 2 FTS, until October 1940, when 2 FTS received its next course of trainees from 3 EFTS at Harewood (which had commenced training in August 1940), while 2 EFTS thereafter fed the new No. 3 FTS at Ohakea. When 4 EFTS at Whenuapai commenced training in December 1940, its entire trainee output was shipped to Canada for their advanced training, but as already hinted out by about mid-1941 these arrangements were cancelled, and thereafter the output of all EFTS's was equally divided roughly evenly between the three NZ FTS's and shipments to Canada.
    David D

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    To David, Col and Errol.
    Thank you gents, what you have sent to the Forum is priceless. David you have given me information which I could not find, not deneigning what Errol has sent earlier. I now have a lot to go on with.
    Col what you have pointed to is fantastic, this is a chapter that has never been told. Sincere thanks, I have a lot of studying -Anzac-POW Freeman in Europe, Chapter 5 is amazing and very sad.
    Does anyone have any information when Sandman was sent to Terezin, possible from Stalag Luft III? Maybe I have missed it.
    I have found that Warren rejoined the RAF/RNZAF after returning to the UK in August 1945. He was at 61 OTU at Keevil for all of the month.
    Many thanks to you all,
    Roy

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    Roy,

    A note about Sandman that I have from the late Colin Hanson reads:

    'Early in 1945, while being transported by train to another PoW camp, Flt Lt Sandman and an American jumped off the train outside Dresden and made their way south across Czechoslovakia receiving assistance from Czech nationals - this service being officially acknowledged post-war. From 23 to 30 Apr 1945 Flt Lt Sandman served with an American Armoured Division and qualified for the France and Germany Star in addition to his Air Crew Europe Star.'

    Sandman is also mentioned in Charles Rollings Wire and Worse and Wire and Walls.

    Errol

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    Thanks for that Errol,
    The question is which camp he was leaving, Stalag Luft III or Terezin?
    Sandy was a never give up type and must have annoyed the Germans to be sent to Stalag Luft III and Terezin.
    Many thanks, Roy

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    Roy,
    Just a small point, but in my massage dated 22/10, Sandman's passing out date should read 20/12/40, not 20/2/40. Would have edited original post, but for some reason I do not have access to edit at the moment. Is anybody else having this problem?
    David D

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