Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16

Thread: Anson N5086, S.wales,23/2/40

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Stalybridge,Cheshire
    Posts
    413
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Anson N5086, S.wales,23/2/40

    Hi All,

    Continuing my h/g Anson project, can anyone provide details of the crew on this one please, I had the 1180 for this one but can`t seem to find it, so don`t even have the pilot, however, I did have in my notes that LAC Sutcliffe was killed on this aircraft.


    N5086
    SAN.
    ST ATHAN
    23/2/40
    RHOSILLI HILL, GLAMORGAN, S.WALES.
    A/c flying a cross country navigation exercise, crashed on high ground in bad visibility. All four were killed. A passenger on board, LAC ANDREW ROBERT SUTCLIFFE, 746751. aged 26, is buried in Brampton (St. Martin) Old Churchyard in Cumbria. A/c had been over the Bristol Channel area and was returning to base in high winds & low cloud at night, the crew were trying to locate a flare path & made several attempts to land but overshot each time, the last attempt resulted in a loud explosion as the aircraft struck a hill.

    PASS: LAC ANDREW ROBERT SUTCLIFFE. 746751. (K)

    Any help as always gratefully received.

    Regards.
    Dave.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    1,319
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts

    Default

    Dave,

    Besides Sutcliffe I have Parks, WC, 562843 and Webster, FA 759344

    regards

    DaveW

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Huddersfield UK
    Posts
    433
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    I think these are the en you are looking for.

    The following 3 men lost their lives on 23/2/40 and deaths were registered at Swansea.
    Sgt (Pilot) William C. PARKES - 562843
    LAC Andrew R. SUTCLIFFE - 746751
    LAC (Obs u/t) Frederic A. WEBSTER - 759344

    Here are the other RAF losses for this day:
    Sgt (Pilot) Gerald BREESE Death registered at Maidenhead.
    AC2 Douglas Watley TURNER Death registered at Chippenham.
    AC2 William LEDSHAM no record found at in England, Wales & Scotland death indexes.
    AC2 Robert James MACKENZIE Death Registered at Grimsby.

    Regards
    Andy

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Stalybridge,Cheshire
    Posts
    413
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Anson N5086, S.wales,23/2/40

    Thanks Dave/Andy,

    Dave,

    The fact that you have Parks (Though spelt without the `e` but with same service no) and Webster, which ties in with what Andy has from the registers, appears to tie in with these men being on this aircraft, though not being able to find my 1180, I don`t know how many crew were on this aircraft, again I think I shall have to request this from Hendon to confirm totals & pilot. I would also need to know how far Rhosilli Hill is from Swansea for deaths to be registered there it must be close by, anyone have a grid ref for this location please? Is this above Rhossili Bay?

    Thank you both for your help, I shall add these to my list unless I hear different.

    Regards.
    Dave.
    Last edited by highgroundsman; 1st December 2007 at 01:32.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    1,319
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts

    Default

    Dave

    Rhossili is in the Swansea registration district (since 1934).

    Rhossili Hill is the local name for what is marked on OS maps as Rhossili Down, which as you suggested , is above Rhossili Bay, 12 miles west of Swansea Airfield 159/4190 approx.

    regards

    DaveW

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Stalybridge,Cheshire
    Posts
    413
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Anson N5086, S.wales,23/2/40

    Thanks Dave,

    I have noted the two `S` and one `L` spelliing also. The airmen do look to be the correct crew from the Anson, but I`ll send for 1180 anyhow to varyfy pilot & check there was only 3 on board and not four.

    Regards.
    Dave.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Caerdydd, Cymru
    Posts
    633
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hi Dave et al,

    Just a quick word of advice regarding the Welsh spelling, which might prove useful if you start examining records of the period. Rhossili has been spelt several different ways over the years, and because it is in a predominantly Welsh-speaking area even now, you may find that the old Welsh (which frankly is even more cryptic than modern Welsh, which is bad enough!!) spelling was used on the reports at the time of the crash. Even if the reports were compiled by RAF Officers, if they were being helped by the locals then the old Welsh spelling would almost certainly have been used.

    I'm always happy to help with the natives if you need it, and particularly any spelling, dialect and language issues - my knowledge of my Mother tongue is not great, but sufficient to decipher some of the period records when need be :D

    L/O

    Greg
    "You can take the boy out of Wales,
    But you can't take Wales out of the boy!!"

    Greg Harrison
    100 Squadron and 100 Squadron Association Historian
    100 Squadron Researcher 1917 - present day
    1 Group Researcher 1940 - 1945

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Stalybridge,Cheshire
    Posts
    413
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hi Greg,

    Thanks for the advice, I had some trouble with the Welsh language on my little Mountain Rescue book on Llandwrog `ALL IN A DAY`S WORK - RAF Mountain Rescue in Snowdonia 1944-46` but fortunately it was a Welsh publisher Gwasg Carreg Gwalch who took it on so could correct my mis-spelt notes.

    I have several Ansons in Wales so may take you up on the offer to help with location spellings, I`ll sort these out and e-mail them on to you in MS Word if that`s OK.

    Regards.
    Dave.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Caerdydd, Cymru
    Posts
    633
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Hello Dave,

    Be my guest - just shout if you need anything at all :) I'm also close to both the Glamorganshire and Swansea Record Offices, and would be happy to spend half a day going through their files for you on any crashes that are likely to be covered by them.

    I should put you in touch with a good friend of mine called Ian Hodgkiss, who really is an authority on Welsh crashes. I'm sure that if you are missing "gen" in any of your Welsh files, he'll be able to help you out. I'll dig out his email address for you.

    L/O

    Greg
    "You can take the boy out of Wales,
    But you can't take Wales out of the boy!!"

    Greg Harrison
    100 Squadron and 100 Squadron Association Historian
    100 Squadron Researcher 1917 - present day
    1 Group Researcher 1940 - 1945

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Stalybridge,Cheshire
    Posts
    413
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Thanks Greg,

    I`ll get those Welsh Anson crash extracts off to you shortly, hope I can return the favour some day.

    Regards.
    Dave.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •