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Thread: 3 Aug 1943 Makowski and Smith

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    Default 3 Aug 1943 Makowski and Smith

    Dear Polish friends and other helpers. I’m seeking today to elucidate the losses in my area (north west Brittany) on this date.
    Firstly, could somebody give the first name of P/O Makowski Z., buried at Brest Kerfautras. Is this airman, the same as the one on the very interesting October 1942 picture of 317 Sqn on the web ? (with a Sgt Rank) And what is the meaning of PPOR. on his grave, above his name ?

    From Gal Bohn book « Raids aériens sur la Bretagne »
    Plabennec, at 10:30 am, a polish fighter crashes near the town. Pilot wounded
    Frederick Crewe shot down near Plabennec in late afternoon
    Thompson R.K shot down near Gouesnou
    Guissény, around 8 pm, an english plane crashes near Guissény (north of Brest, on the coast) Pilot POW

    According to Norman Franks Fighter Command Losses, four fighters were really lost that day, two pilots killed, and two POW. By crossing those data, I think we could admit that if F/O Crewe (who I met some years ago) did crashlanded east of Plabennec, POW, and P/O Thompson also crashlanded on Plabennec, but was subsequently buried at Gouesnou, then, it would be PPOR. Makowski Z. who crashed north of Plabennec in the morning and F/O Smith E. who crashlanded (and not ditched) near Guissény.
    By the way could somebody also give F/O Smith first name, POW number and camp (s), or link to ?

    A local account brought but a woman last year, said the pilot captured at Guissény was Australian, what would match perfectly.

    Thanks to all

    Gildas

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    Default 3 Aug 1943 Makowski and Smith

    Hello Gildas,

    This is his full name:

    P/O Zbigniew Makowski. Service number P.2206.

    I do not know the Polish rank system compared with the British, but translated PPOR (podporucznik) should be a 2nd Lt.

    Am I right....Polish researchers?

    Regards

    Finn Buch

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    Default

    Some details (time, rough location, reason for loss) are here:

    http://orb.polishaf.pl/317sqn/1943/1943-08-no-317-squadron-f540

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    Thanks to both of you. I ignored this link for the moment, but sure will have to consult it again. It's a pity there's no source given on Gal Bohn book to say how he was able to find this. His son did consult ORB's, but among the local accounts, ... And unfortunately, he's not there anymore.
    Gildas

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    Default

    hello,

    I confirm ppor is equivalent to Pilot Officer / 2nd Lieutenant or our french sous-lieutenant, and por equals Flying Officer / 1st Lieutenant / Lieutenant.

    I don't know the amount of "rough" material you have gathered for your research, but you really need to check the ORBs for times of take-off and landing of the different units involved, the Archives départementales for Police and Gendarmerie reports (which would give you locations, times, sometimes fates), and the PoW questionnaires (WO344 series at Kew). In some cases, the pilots gave precisely the name of the village where they were captured. Otherwise you can sometimes eliminate one name because the location doesn't match (I did this here in northern France when it appeared a pilot actually baled out over the Channel and was captured by a German rescue boat, usually these details don't appear at all in FCL).

    The WO344 series PoW questionnaire would give you all the details you seek, as first names, service numbers, date of birth, wartime address, camps, etc... I have copied several Smith, but all connected with my research in my area, and Britanny is just too far away...

    Good luck

    Joss

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    Thanks for your reply Joss,

    This research is a great passion, but work and family life don’t allow me to spend more time on it, not as much I would like. Already oo much for my family !
    It’s certain many archives would give answers, but I can’t afford to go to Kew and pay the numerous necessary prints for the moment. As I can’t buy each book for most of the time only a few pages linked to my area. I did take Chorley and Frank first series.

    I was very happy to see the polish records were now on the web, but for British, It would take so long, and Americans even sell them on the web. Do they really intend to bring answers to relatives or researchers as we are, or only make money on the back of those airmen who died for our precious liberty ? I wonder.
    Recently, a serie of interesting pictures of an Albacore crashed just a few miles from where I live were sold, but at a price so high, that my friend who saw that, couldn’t just think to be able to get them.
    And it’s also time to get the last local accounts, before it’s too late. When an archive will have given a place, without old people memory, it won’t be possible to find the crash site around this place.

    Thanks again, maybe later for the archives. Should try the Loto !
    Gildas

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    Default Hello :)

    Hello, Zbigniew Makowski was a brother of my grandfather, if you want to see his photos look for this link ---> http://www.geodigital.h2.pl/maq/zbyszek/zbyszek.htm. There are links to site with his cemetery and grave. In the future i want to create a site about history of my family. Now i have this only. If you know something else about him, please send it to my email: player_1@[no_spam]tlen.pl. Greetz 4 All :)

    - Krzysztof Makowski

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