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Thread: Temp W/O Emrys HOPKINS 1315559 204 Squadron?

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    Default Temp W/O Emrys HOPKINS 1315559 204 Squadron?

    A bit of a saga here so bear with me.

    During my Sunderland research one of the incidents I came across was Sunderland JM672 of 204 Squadron that crashed just after take off in Sierra Leone on the 28th August 1944.
    The Squadron ORB for 204 for this month is a bit scant on details so as usual I went elsewhere to try and get the names of the crew. I came across this link
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...hgmo/htmlembed
    Which shows the fatalities for that incident and they include the above airman, and a date of death as 29th August 1944 ie the day after. Nothing unusual in that so I took it as read (more fool me). A check of the CWG shows him 204 Squadron too, but I failed to notice an anomaly in the date of death which shows 29th September 1944.

    I was trying to get hold of the details of the rest of the crew so contacted AHB. It transpires that W/O Hopkins was not aboard JM672 and was not on 204 Squadron. He was killed aboard Liberator EV885 of 206 Squadron that went missing on 28th September 1944. All the other crew that were killed on the Liberator are shown correctly with that date of death in the database here. Emrys Hopkins is missing from that list and presumably should be shown on the unaccounted list for 29th September 1944, but isn't. I don't quite understand how the unaccounted lists are derived. Anyhow thanks to AHB for the correction and I do now have a complete crew list for JM672 if anyone is interested.

    If someone with more knowledge about things than me knows how to correct and amend the records that would be great

    Thanks

    Chris

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    Chris

    If you're after getting the CWGC details changed, the R.C.A.F. Service File for F/Sgt A. M. McClelland has a 'Post Presumption Memorandum 566/47' for EW885, dated 22.4.47, which includes the names and service numbers of the crew missing in EV855, Hopkins included.

    Not sure if this would be enough to get the CWGC to change their entry, but it may be worth a go.

    Regards

    Simon

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    Simon, Thank you for your reply.

    My point in posting this, was really that everything you read on-line isn't necessarily true so double check your facts. The CWGC is in fact riddled with errors, (I personally have come across, in my limited research, 20+ errors) but I do not feel it is my place to rectify them, especially when the onus is on me to produce evidence, but occasionally those errors are compounded by not cross referencing as is shown in the example of the otherwise very good document. I won't go into battle with the CWGC to get them to rectify something that is clearly wrong.
    Please don't get me wrong CWGC is an excellent resource that has made my project infinitely easier, but there are mistakes.

    Chris

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    cozzy711,

    In the "Otherwise very good document", that you proffer, there are at least two (2) mystifyng entries:

    1./

    No.204 Casualties: Sheet1.

    1942.

    N/A - Unknown Cause - 2/22/1942 - ASHWORTH,FRED - Sergeant - 1059874 - RAF (VR) - United Kingdom - Panel 77 - Runnymede Memorial.

    1059874 Sergeant (W.Op./Air Gnr.) Fred ASHWORTH RAFVR, was not a member of No.204 Sqn., he was a member of the crew of No.209 Sqn, Catalina I AH558, that crashed soon take-off, at approx. 0445 hours, near the mouth of Milford Haven, Pembrokeshire, on 22 February, 1942. No trace of the crew was ever found.

    https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1252724 - Download - Go to p.47 of 535).

    2./

    1943.

    N/A - Unknown Cause - 4/13/1943 - CROSSMAN,EDWARD FRANCIS - Sergeant - 1386098 - RAF (VR) - United Kingdom - Panel 146 - Runnymede Memorial.

    1386098 Sergeant Edward Francis CROSSMAN RAFVR, was lost in No.204 Sqn., Sunderland III JM669:KG-A, presumed to have encountered violent storm and sent message, "Landing on sea", wreckage found at 20'26'N 17'30'W, S of Port Etienne (10 killed).

    See:
    Ocean Sentinel The Short Sunderland.
    Hamlin, John F. et al.
    Staplefield:Air-Britain (Historians),2012.
    pp.118-9.

    and ...

    http://rafcommands.com/database/ward...hp?qnum=102111

    http://rafcommands.com/archive/13969.php

    All crew (other than Crossman), incorrectly listed on CWGC as No.20 Sqn.

    Col.

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