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Thread: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

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    Default 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Warner lists Blenheim I L4866 of 211 Sqn as being abandoned at Araxos in Greece after a forced landing on 2 Dec 40.
    L4866 was of course a Blenheim IV lost with 17 OTU on 12 Oct 40.
    L8466 must be a possibility, for which Henk's database says lost with 211 Sqn on 30 May 41. Maybe it was in fact recovered from Araxos? Or is the later date incorrect?
    Thoughts anyone please?

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    L8466
    http://www.211squadron.org/bristol_b...m_i.html#L8466
    and
    http://www.211squadron.org/1940.html#2DecF541
    and
    http://www.211squadron.org/1941.html#AppKJan41

    "L8466 8/211 Lost in Greece 5.41" is the bald entry in
    Halley, Royal Air Force Aircraft L1000-N9999 (Air Britain 1993)
    Presumably the source of HW's matching brief entry, either that or perhaps
    Gunby & Temple Royal Air Force Bomber Losses in the Middle East and Mediterranean Vol 1: 1939-1942 (Midland 2006)
    where the brief May 1941 entry records L8466 as fate "unknown" if incorrectly as a Mark IV - duly corrected to Mark I & the only revision for that a/c in Vol 2 Section 4

    No further info to hand on fate, nor sighted in unpublished ms & db notes kindly made available by Pel Temple.
    Aircraft losses in Greece 1940 1941, esp non-op, are often sparsely recorded if at all.

    Sources
    As linked from my www.211squadron.org and sourced thus
    211 Squadron Operations Record Book (AIR 27/1302) and Form 540 Form 541 & my Transcripts & introductory notes, 1940, 1941
    Sgt JG Sharrat Observer’s and Air Gunner’s Flying Log Book
    Sgt W Wright Observer’s and Air Gunner’s Flying Log Book

    Gunby & Temple Royal Air Force Bomber Losses in the Middle East and Mediterranean Vol 1: 1939-1942 (Midland 2006) & Vol 2 1943-1945 (Air Britain 2018)
    Halley, Royal Air Force Aircraft L1000-N9999 (Air Britain 1993)
    Warner The Bristol Blenheim: A Complete History (Crecy 2005)
    Last edited by Don Clark; 7th January 2021 at 23:59. Reason: addnl refs
    Toujours propos

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Hello,

    One other book certainly worth consulting is:

    Blenheims Over Greece And Crete 1940-1941
    Cull,Brian with Brian Lord, Themis Serbis, Ian Carter, Aleks Ognjevic & Ludivico Slongo.
    N.P.:Fonthill Media Ltd.,2017

    You can pick up a softcover edition of the above at the moment, from: https://www.naval-military-press.com...ete-1940-1941/

    Col.

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Don, Col,
    Thanks for your input, L8466 it is.
    Andy

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    You're quite welcome. 211 Squadron RAF has long been of the greatest interest to me.

    Every piece of work on the sad Greek campaign of 1940-1941 is of interest. Each has to deal with the difficult state of the original sources.
    If now somewhat easier, still difficult as Cull would have found in 2006, compiling Blenheims Over Greece and Crete 1940-1941.

    My own 211 Squadron work is based as far as possible upon original sources, including a number of flying logbooks.
    Worth repeating that every record is subject to error and omission at the time, and loss or later copy. As is every later compilation.
    With a website, I'm still able to readily revise, correct and update as time passes. Search functions are also invaluable.

    Perhaps then the following, being those of which I am aware re 211 Squadron, will assist when consulting the above and Appendix 1 Blenheim Losses.

    RAF Blenheim losses
    7 Dec L1381 for 211 Sqn read 84 Sqn

    18 Feb L6662 for 211 Sqn read 84 Sqn

    26 Mar N5910 Gladiator 211 Sqn [sic 112 Sqn a/c] "shot down"
    While formal accounts of 211 Sqn CO Nedwill's crash differ in detail, in sum they indicate that the final 112 Sqn airfield defensive patrol of the day encountered no opposition, was then ordered to return, and having broken off to do so, Nedwill's a/c then dived into the ground near the airfield.
    My www.211squadron.org/1941.html#26March refers.
    Sources as cited there, for much of which I am forever indebted to my friend Errol Martyn of NZ, whose numerous works are exemplary.
    Brief bio for S/Ldr RJC Nedwill AFC: http://www.211squadron.org/personnel_rolls.html#Nedwill

    Blenheims destroyed/written off/abandoned, ground
    22 March L8533 destroyed Paramythia Mc200 strafe
    Damaged that day, yes, and thereafter operationally u/s lacking turret certainly, but serviceable for non-op flying nevertheless as late as 14 April.
    Left at Paramythia, abandoned, 16 April on 211 Sqn withdrawal (Clark, 16 Apr entry)
    My
    http://www.211squadron.org/cfr_clark.html#14Apr
    and
    http://www.211squadron.org/bristol_b...m_i.html#L8533
    refer

    26 March L8466 possibly destroyed Paramythia
    Again, flying on an op as late as 13 April to t/b with one engine u/s
    My
    http://www.211squadron.org/jg_sharratt.html#L8466
    and
    http://www.211squadron.org/w_wright.html#L8466
    and
    http://www.211squadron.org/bristol_b...m_i.html#L8466
    refer

    Sources as noted here, & on site, & incl the Flying Log Books of Sgts Clark*, Sharratt** and Wright*, originals (*) & copy (**) in my collection.
    If perhaps not quite obvious, 211 Squadron Sgt Observer CFR "Nobby" Clark, 1916-2003, was my father
    Last edited by Don Clark; 9th January 2021 at 06:40.
    Toujours propos

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Don,
    Thanks again for this interesting extra information. Your website is impressive, I am sure I will refer to it again in the future.
    Andy

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Appreciate your remarks.

    On ADF Serials - a very useful site & board - you seem mainly to be interested in the modern Aus & NZ defence force aircraft, and a few historic airframes.

    May I ask what is your interest in the Bristol Blenheim, often your topic here?
    Last edited by Don Clark; 9th January 2021 at 22:12.
    Toujours propos

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Don,
    Nothing particularly specific. I am often curious about anomalies in the info listed in books, and like to resolve them, if only to help ensure the next writer doesn't make the same mistake. I am currently reading Warner's Blenheim opus. It is not a specific criticism of this book, because we all make mistakes, but I am often struck by the fact that although books are proof-read in terms of grammar, spelling etc, quite often the serial number information is not (duplicate entries for the same aircraft etc).
    Andy

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    Default Re: 211 Sqn Blenheim loss 2 Dec 40

    Thanks,indeed Andy. Repeating mistakes - couldn't agree more.

    There's no shortage of errors, some quite basic, copied repeatedly, in many works of both greater and lesser profile.
    I dislike errors for the amount of extra work they create, though the unravelling of them can uncover more interesting details.
    Checking to source - even indifferent source, if carefully assessed - is invaluable.

    While I've been able to unravel a fair crop of others published blunders around the 211 Sqn story, there are also no doubt still some blips in my own work to fix as I find 'em.
    The risk, eg, of creating transcription errors, working single-handed, in typing up the Squadron Operations Record Book, is pretty clear and I hope none remain.
    But it was a risk worth taking, for the value of being able to text search all the years I could manage.

    As for Warner, he managed to secure - for such a large work - two editions and was thus able to revise & amend a fair degree. An admirable work.
    Likewise Gunby and Temple, though unhelpfully delayed by a design stoush beyond their control: Vol 2 (thanks to Air Britain)gives corrections for many gremlins in Vol 1, again admirable work.
    Errol Martyn, as author and publisher, simply (!) made his For Your Tomorrow into three sensibly ordered vols, compiled and published at a pace and cost he (& readers) could manage in 1998, 1999 and 2008, progressively adding additions and amendments to Vol I in Vol II, and to both in Vol III. Exemplary.
    Likewise Jeff Jefford, first in RAF Squadrons, (Airlife 1998, 2001) which set out to collate, add and correct others published Sqn summary details - the 2nd edn allowing a substantial update. Invaluable. In The Flying Camels: The History of No 45 Squadron of (Jefford 1995) the self-published result is a tour de force in 536 A4 pages: no 2nd edn, understandably, but, in 2009, a five page (!) set of corrections, addns and amplifications.

    There's a temptation, for some, to see a Flying Log Book,Operations Record Book, or memoir of contemporary date as the correct record.
    But plainly they too are all subject to mistakes, omission and loss.
    As my Dad once said, of Log Books, getting the paper work right was not the first thing they thought of after coming back from being shot at.

    Thanks again...
    Last edited by Don Clark; 10th January 2021 at 14:12.
    Toujours propos

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