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Thread: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

  1. #1
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    Default Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    Does anyone have any documents which show the bomb loads for this operation. The focus is 4 Group (35 Squadron), with research to date suggesting 2 x 4000lb (although I don't have any formal documents to confirm this)

    Any help would be much appreciated

    Regards

    PeteT
    Main areas of research:

    - CA Butler and the loss of Lancaster ME334 (http://rafww2butler.wordpress.com/ )
    - Aircrew Training (Basic / Trade / Operational / Continuation / Conversion)
    - The History of No. 35 Squadron (1916 - 1982) (https://35squadron.wordpress.com/)

    [Always looking for copies of original documents / photographs etc relating to these subjects]

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    Hi Pete: I checked the ORBs and there is no indication of the loads carried. I suspect you knew this as you asked the question! However, I have never seen an occasion where 2 X 4,000 lb bombs were carried. That doesn't mean they were not carried, however, it would require special modification to the bomb carriers.

    I understand this Squadron was equipped with Halifaxes?

    Jim

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    Gents, I don't know whether this helps:
    From Wings of War:
    Chapter 7, Flt Lt Geoffrey Hall Porter, Halifax W1211, NP-J, 158 Sqn
    25-26 Jul 42 briefed for Duisberg.
    Bomb load: 8x 1000lb bombs
    https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=...201942&f=false

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    We didn’t have anything that could carry two 4,000 pounders.

    Edit: I stand corrected - just seen below. Apparently we did. You live and learn!
    Last edited by ianh; 16th August 2022 at 18:37.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to ianh For This Useful Post:

    JDCAVE (16th August 2022)

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    The original enquirer has had some discussions during the day with people who have an interest in the Halifax and it has been suggested that a 2 x 4000 load was possible.

    The following link offers some info. on the loads

    https://tailendcharlietedchurch.word...fax-bomb-load/

    I am trying to understand if the 4000lb bomb was the same as the 4000 cookie (which seemed to need the bomb doors slightly open)

    Once again, another interesting subject

    Regards

    PeteT
    Last edited by PeteT; 16th August 2022 at 18:11.
    Main areas of research:

    - CA Butler and the loss of Lancaster ME334 (http://rafww2butler.wordpress.com/ )
    - Aircrew Training (Basic / Trade / Operational / Continuation / Conversion)
    - The History of No. 35 Squadron (1916 - 1982) (https://35squadron.wordpress.com/)

    [Always looking for copies of original documents / photographs etc relating to these subjects]

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    The 10 Squadron ORB shows that their Halifaxes did attacks on July 25th to Duisburg, the 26th to Hamburg and on the 29th to Saarbrucken armed with “2/4000 lb. H.C. Bombs”. The night raid report for Duisburg also states that 54 4000 lb. bombs were dropped but not the number of aircraft that dropped them.
    Last edited by David Wallace; 16th August 2022 at 19:16.

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    Pete: I found this entry for 10 Squadron, P/O Hillier, Halifax II, same raid:

    https://discovery.nationalarchives.g...mageViewerLink

    2/4,000 lb bombs

    The next night, July 26, 1944, a S/L Griffiths dropped "2/4,000 HC Bombs" and Hillier once again dropped "2/4,000 lb bombs"

    (Edit: Dave beat me to it! LOL!)

    Jim
    Last edited by JDCAVE; 16th August 2022 at 19:30.

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    102 Squadron were carrying 4000lb bombs on numerous occasions during July 1942

    Topcliffe Operation Order for 25th July states:-

    7 A/C. B,D,C,G,P,O,T, 3 X 1000 G.P. 12 SBC’s 90 X 4 Incend.
    Remaining A/C. 2 x 4000lb

    ORB also clearly states Bomb load of 2 X 4000 H.C

    Pete

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    This thread begs why questions: “Why wasn’t this load carried later in the war?” And “Did the Lancaster carry this load.” I’ve looked at lots of ORB records, September 1944 and on and have not seen this type of load.

    I wonder if it had to do with the poor aerodynamics/ballistics of the 4,000 lb HC and the ensuing explosion should the two bombs contact on another upon release?

    Jim

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    Default Re: Duisburg 25/26 July 1942

    The background to the enquiry relates to a particular crash site and whether the bombs were released prior to the crash. The only survivor recorded that 2 x 4000lb were dropped from 18,500ft, suggesting that they are not still with the aircraft, but as per the original post, we have been trying to establish if this was the standard load for all 35 Squadron aircraft on this operation.

    The debate regarding the method of carrying this combination in the Halifax and then in the Lancaster is an interesting one, with little to go by in books or on the internet. One site does state "500-lb bomb in each of 6 Wing bays + 1 x 8000-lb bomb in Fuselage Bomb bay (2 x 4000lb bombs could be carried instead of 1 x 8000lb)" .... but no details on how.

    I will try to follow this up (time permitting) but as has been stated in previous posts, it certainly wasn't a "standard" configuration, so why was it being utilised during this particular time period
    Main areas of research:

    - CA Butler and the loss of Lancaster ME334 (http://rafww2butler.wordpress.com/ )
    - Aircrew Training (Basic / Trade / Operational / Continuation / Conversion)
    - The History of No. 35 Squadron (1916 - 1982) (https://35squadron.wordpress.com/)

    [Always looking for copies of original documents / photographs etc relating to these subjects]

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