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Thread: This one's a Hudson - FK593 lost 28 Nov 1942

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    Default This one's a Hudson - FK593 lost 28 Nov 1942

    P/O Norman Allen, RCAF, J/11491 died at sea on ferry flight of Hudson FK593 (checked the serials, it's a Hudson). Lost between Gander, Nfld. and UK. Civilian J.P Kiernan on board at the time.

    Can someone give me the other crew names and does Anyone recognize Kiernan and who he might have been? And what was a civilian doing on a ferry flight?
    David

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    Not a civilian

    Name: KIERNAN, JOSEPH PETER
    Initials: J P
    Nationality: United Kingdom
    Rank: Captain
    Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Ferry Command
    Age: 30
    Date of Death: 28/11/1942
    Additional information: Son of Joseph and Ethel Kiernan; husband of Martha Kiernan.
    Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
    Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 288.
    Memorial: RUNNYMEDE MEMORIAL

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    Okay, thanks Amrit. So now I am definitely suspecting the source of info on my two "Hudsons" (one of which was a Mitchell). It's "They Shall Not Grow Old".
    Last edited by dfuller52; 8th January 2009 at 01:18. Reason: corrected book title
    David

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    Amrit, I'm risking a kicking here, he would be a civilian contractor of Ferry Command, not quite a civilian but not of Military rank either, Captain in the CWGC would refer to his being an aircraft captain.

    Christy's Ocean Bridge give the crew as:
    P/O Albert Moore Carey RCAf
    Joseph Kiernan (Am Civ - American Civilian)
    P/O Norman Alexander Allen RCAF
    F/O Irwin Edward Stillwell Robinson RCAF

    Ocean Bridge lists it as Hudson FK693?

    Ocean Bridge lists many of those killed as 'Civilians',
    Example:
    DE BRETIGNY, LIONEL DORIA 12/11/1942 Rank Radio Officer
    http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=232073

    William Campbell Chitty 14/10/1942 Rank Navigator
    http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=2259338

    Someone can probably put better words to this but Ferry Command used combinations of Service Personnel and Civilian contractors. This last term is probably a poor discription of them. Many radio operators were former Candian railway signal men. This is a really poor explanation for someone with Ocean bridge sitting open in front of him! (Its a big book).

    David, Are you requesting all your RCAF men's service records from the Canadian national archives?

    I can't really find any one on the 1920 or 1930 census that would fit the bit but then I can't see his mother on it either!
    Last edited by dennis_burke; 7th January 2009 at 20:45. Reason: Census failure
    Dennis Burke
    - Dublin

    Foreign Aircrew and Aircraft Ireland 1939-1945
    www.ww2irishaviation.com

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    Thanks Dennis, Allison & Hayward are vindicated on one of the "two" Hudsons (although the s/n is off).

    Yes, I am going to be requesting files on all 103 of my Malvern boys but obviously, it's going to take a while. I have spoken with Ottawa and they didn't choke over the phone when I told them about the project, however they did ask that I send them a neat list.

    I also plan to visit Ottawa at some point but it's hard to get away from work and Toronto.

    In the meantime, I am asking questions to give me clues on what to look for when I can spend time in the archives.

    But Amrit, you get points for checking CWGC when I didn't think to do it, he being a civilian.
    Last edited by dfuller52; 10th January 2009 at 13:09.
    David

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