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Thread: Mosquito DZ712 151 Sq lost 17/5/1943 : Official documents

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    Default Mosquito DZ712 151 Sq lost 17/5/1943 : Official documents

    greetings,

    I't been more than a year since I was last looking at RAF records for the loss of 75 Squadron BK646. I'm now interested in the loss of RAF Mosquito DZ712 from 151 Squadron. crew were .

    Pilot, Wing Commander IVINS, DONALD VERNON

    Navigator, Warrant Officer DALY, WILLIAM PATRICK

    When I investigated BK646 I was able to obtain AIR24 reports on the loss of the aircraft. Would there be a loss report from this plane or any other reports that mention the details. BK646 was a 7 man crew Stirling and 6 of the crew survived (2 evaders and 4 POW) so perhaps that meant there was more evidence ?

    Perhaps Squadron records for 151 squadron would be of more interest. I am in contact with the daughter of Warrant Officer Daly and said I would try to find as much detail as I could.

    many thanks


    Jonathan

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    Hi Jonathan:

    Found some details for this one on a French website:

    http://www.absa39-45.asso.fr/Pertes%20Bretagne/Cotes%20Armor/17%20mai%2043/151sqdn.htm

    The long and short of it is, they appear to have been hit by flak while strafing rail traffic at a spot where strafes had taken place before - the German flak was lying in wait.

    I got part-way through the Babelfish automatic translation, can do the rest if you really need but can't do it just now.



    Testimony regarding the crash of Mosquito II DZ712, into the wood of La Haie en Tramin on the night of the 17/18 May, 1943.

    Testimony collected by Mr. David Ivins, son, in 1994.

    Mr. Raymond P, the "Old Baron" in Tramin, then old of 13-14 years old.

    "They came every night to machine-gun the trains which passed. They skimmed the ground and the Germans came to install flak batteries. On the nights which followed, they fired at the aircraft and finally brought one down. The plane grazed a farmhouse, it tore off two or three trees, then it fell into a field of clover and then it exploded, all burnt. All the clover roasted and the crew were burnt.

    The next morning, I went to see. And in the afternoon, they came to take them away. They brought two coffins. One coffin was carried by French and the other by Germans and they took them along on the coast. (Dinard).

    Mr. David Ivins: He died immediately?

    Mr. Raymond P: Yes, yes, yes, they were calcified, they were burnt. They would not have suffered, it was too quick.

    The Germans even used the coffin as a bridge because there was a small brook, to get over they put it across. But the Frenchman who who was in charge there said "You will wash it, clean it immediately, because I will not take it looking like that".

    They nevertheless paid their respects, the Germans. They fired in the air to show their respect.

    Mr. David Ivins: What time of night was it?

    Mr. Raymond P: Could be 11:00, midnight. It was in these hours there that the trains passed. It was already on fire when it passed over the top of this house, it was already losing altitude. The Germans were there, hiding. And during the day, not to show themselves, they went behind the trees to hide. And there they had connected the telephone to know if planes were detected.

    I believe there were German casualties, because it appears that the ambulances arrived and that there were some who were crying out there, some of the Germans. There must have been some wounded or of killed. (Nothing in the cemetery registers at Dinard or Huisnes on Sea for killed.) Everything was burned up, the crew too - their legs had even been burned away. When they put them in the coffin, they had to put something on the bodies.

    And then there, they paid their respects, they fired in the air. It was a big honour guard, 20 or 25 or 30.

    They had many batteries set up. Sometimes they were here, sometimes over there, but often it was over there. The Germans had said to them: " This evening, you will leave your house because this evening something will occur".

    Mr. Jean B, witness of the crash landing: That happened around 11:30. It did not make good surrounding because that pétait. There were Germans everywhere in the fields there. The ground n' was not as it is at the current day. They had made small trenches to be camouflaged. That went there. Animals in l' stable lowed. They drew on l' plane. It had come mitrailler the train. They often came mitrailler here because the terrain was open, it did not have trees. Fortunately, the plane n' the end of the house did not catch. One would have been all died in it. One n' did not dare to leave so much that l' plane, shells, of the cartridges, all. Incredible how that pétait. It would have been said that drew all the time.

    Mr. Raymond P: It must there have Germans of wounded too.

    Mr. Jean b: Yes, yes, yes, they were made shake. Surely qu' they had caught. C' was not funny. When one was to see l' plane where c' is qu' it had caught all the trees. It had caught five oaks, but in top. It had cut down five or six apple trees, uprooted. All was roasted around. They remained a fifteen or so days. As long as l' plane n' would not have been very cleared. One now finds nothing any more. At the qu' beginning; one plowed, one always found something. C' was hidden in the ground, of the cartridges or the remains of l' plane. L' plane was completely shredded. They n' did not suffer. Those which were there to keep l' plane c' were the old ones. Y had three guy to keep, c' were of the old men. They on our premises came to make a turn. They made us include/understand: " One should not be là" any more;.

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    Thanks - that's excellent, I do actually know Daniel who runs that site. he helped me with BK646 , also listed on their site. The translation though is a real help as my French is poor.

    I think I may have also gone wrong in assuming this was bomber command. the squadron seem to have initially been a night fighter squadron. I wonder if there are official accounts of the loss of aircraft for fighter command too

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