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Thread: Query Ross RNLI Salcombe Records

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    Default Query Ross RNLI Salcombe Records

    Ross

    I know this is outside the normal reference of RAF Queries but I posted it on TOCH then I realised that the incident would have probably involved the RNLI at Salcombe and I know you have incidents digitized.. I wonder if you could look in your records? To at least confirm the date.. Then we might get nearer Identifying the correct date..

    Thanks

    Here is what I posted on TOCH

    "B-17" Mystery "March 1942"

    I have just came back from 2 weeks holiday, and one of the enjoyable things I do is read/buy some local produced history booklets especially if they deal with WW2... These are usually written by some very enthusastic individuals but there are times when there base historic aviation knowledge can let them down... But they can put 'flesh' on a story.. here is my problem..


    I have just come back from 2 weeks in the South Hams, Devon where I picked up a booklet called 'Burgh Island and Bigbury Bay of Yesterday'... For an idea of where this is see the following link..

    http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&so...0&z=14&iwloc=A


    Anyway there is a passage at the back which says

    "In March, 1942, a Flying Fortress returning from a bombing mission at St. Nazaire also came down into the water at the estuary mouth. The crowd which gathered to watch this exciting episode was treated to the spectacle of crew members clambering aboard their rubber dinghy, then rowing to safety on the Bantham side of the river. The plane was later dismantled".

    I have a few worries about this, the fact that a Flying Fortress was involved.. especially baring the date mentiuoned.. This would seem to be too early for USAAF Missions and 90 Sqn RAF had finished with them by then.. . Yet the type is clearly mentioned...

    Also in March 1942 the only missions to St Nazaire involved Hampdens, Whitleys, Stirlings and Wellingtons.. and I can find no 'likely losses'

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_pen

    Could it be another mission to other Submarine Pens or other dates say March 1943???

    Can anyone identify this incident, the date and aircraft concerned?"

    Jerry Brewer has identified it probably still exists

    http://www.ukdiving.co.uk/wrecks/wreck.php?id=442

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    Hi Paul,

    They are a year or so out.

    16/09/43
    407th BS/92nd BG
    B-17F-80-BO
    #42-29965

    Lt F T Prasse crew

    Op: Cognac, Alconbury, Bomber Command Mission 97

    (My USAAF Sea Losses Database)

    Hope Cove, Devon
    About 17:30 in the afternoon on the 16th September 1943, an American Fortress aeroplane crashed into the sea four miles north west of Bolt Tail and her crew of ten took to their dinghy. The sea was rough with a moderate south west wind blowing. Ex-coxswain Isaac Jarvis, now ages 78 years, and his grandson, aged 20, were returning from fishing in their motor boat. They rescued the airmen at some risk, for their boat was overloaded, and one of the men was badly injured. The Salcombe lifeboat was launched, but was recalled. A silver cup was presented by the crew of the aeroplane to their rescuers.

    Rewards 4 and 3s for fuel used.

    September 16th Salcombe, Devon
    An aeroplane had come down in the sea, but her crew had been picked up from their rubber dinghy by a Hope Cove fishing boat.

    Rewards 6 13s

    (RNLI Records of Service 1939-46)

    Jerry is not correct to link these. He has picked up on the reference to a number of fuselages dumped around Burgh Island (not the crash location) of Catalina Lend Lease aircraft stripped/scrapped and sea dumped before being carried by the tides to the location.

    I've dived this location so can personally verify the contents.

    Regards
    Ross
    The Intellectual Property contained in this message has been assigned specifically to this web site.
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    Ross

    Many Many Thanks....


    Mystery Solved.....

    Kind Regards

    Paul

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    Ross

    Really sorry to question something.. But all references I can find for 42-29965 say it was lost on the 6th Sept 1943 (NOT 16th) on a mission to Stuttgart... (Includes Baugher)

    Also the 92 Bomb

    I accpt the Mission on the 16th was 97 to Cognac, Alconbury, Bomber Command Mission 97, but if you look at

    http://www.92ndma.org/missions.htm

    You will see the 92 did not fly any missions between 10th and 22nd due to move from Alconbury to Podington

    The Stuttgart mission is written up here: (Ignore date 6 November 1943 - Should be Sept) and the losses


    -3. Seven a/c of the 92nd Bomb Group were lost and one wrecked as follows.
    A/c 668-J reported ditched, crew rescued at 1310.
    A/c 428-O reported ditched, crew rescued.
    A/c 965-L reported S.O.S. at 5038N 0038E at 1243 hours. Crew rescued.
    A/c 000-D unreported.
    A/c 890-C unreported.
    A/c 198-M crash landed in England at 5051N 0035E at hours [sic]. Three men injured. Seven returned to base. A/c back.
    A/c 010-X observed to crash 5018N 0210E at 0815 hours. Five men parachuted. Three chutes blossomed. One chute failed to open. One chute was afire. Apparently no e/a attacking and no flak.
    A/c observed burning amidship at 16,500. Wing broke off at 16,000 1225 hours at 5030N 0040E at 10,000 feet. A/c ditched in sea.
    1229 hours at 5047N 0029E at 12,000 feet a/c ditched in sea. A probable dinghy observed in sea at 1221 hours 5015N 0050E at 16,000 feet.

    Confirm with MARC list here.. http://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/MACRmonthly/43SepMACR.htm

    741 430906 B-17 42-30000 92 327 Bogard '000-D'
    546 430906 B-17 42-30300 95 334 Tyler '010-X'
    740 430906 B-17 42-5890 92 327 Christenson '890-C '

    Could the date be 6th September (not 16th?) or could it be another aircraft?..

    Paul
    Last edited by paulmcmillan; 8th September 2009 at 15:54.

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    The loss 16th Sept 1943 of Bolt Head

    was

    42-29699 not 42-29965

    http://www.384thbombgroup.com/php/OneCrew.php?SortieKey=585

    Pilot Price, W

    Thanks AS.....

    Crew details

    http://memories.384thbombgroup.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=108:m ission024&catid=54:september1943missions&Itemid=10 6
    Last edited by paulmcmillan; 8th September 2009 at 22:59.

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    Hi All,
    Interesting and sorry for the confusion by me ...

    As they would say on flypast forum ....
    .... will the catalinas be at legends...

    maybe someone needs to do some salvaging before it's to late..
    makes you wonder what else is around..
    cheers
    Jerry

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