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Thread: Route/Length of journey.

  1. #1
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    Default Route/Length of journey.

    Hi,
    Would anyone happen to know the route taken on the night of 31st Aug 43 to Munchengladbach, trying to establish if 199sqdn Stirling was lost on outward or homeward journey, took off 00.40hrs, shot down 03.56. Any thoughts welcomed.
    Cheers....Alan.

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    Default Route / Length of Journey

    Hi Alan

    I don't have anything on the raid details, but just looking at what you've supplied: flying tiime 3 hrs 16 mins and if we say a Stirling would cruise at say 200 mph would give a potential distance flown of about 650 miles.

    199 Sqn was based at Lakenheath, Suffolk (?) in August '43, and Munchengladbach isn't very far into Germany over the Dutch border.

    At a guess from that, even allowing for route doglegs, if it'd flown 550-650 miles and had been in the air for three and a quarter hours I'd say it was probably on the way home when it was shot down.

    Not at all scientific but a reasonable guess?

    Ian

  3. #3
    Doug Cuthbertson Guest

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    Alan,
    Routing for Monchengladbach, 30/31 August 1943;

    5210N/0240E - Knocke - 5100N/0430E - Target - 5135N/0340E - 5210N/0240E - UK.
    There is a note on the Loss Card to say that the burial place of Woensel, Eindhoven, is at posn 5126N/0528E, so there may have been some consideration to it being off route.
    Doug.

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    Ian/Doug,
    Thanks for the information, much appreciated and a great help.
    Regards.........Alan.

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    Gents, Using the route given by Doug it would be almost certain they were on the way home. Using info in a 75 Sqn Nav's logbook, he flew two Stirling ops to Duisberg, somewhat nth of but only 12 nm east of Monchengladbach, and the flight time was 4 hrs 25 mins. The burial place is not far off track; drawing a straight line from Monchengladbach to 5135N/0340E, the burial posn is 7nm right of track. Regards, Terry

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    Gents, I believe we're talking here on Stirling BK650, shot down by a night fighter and crashed near the "De Voorhoeve" farm, Altweerter Heide, SW of Valkenswaard, 31-8-1943, 04.00h.
    Regards,
    Henk.

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    The 199 Squadron Stirling lost on 30-31/8/43 on the Munchengladbach raid was EE917 EX-L flown by the very experienced crew piloted by F/Sgt. Athol Harlem RAAF. F/Sgt. Harlem's niece is a member of the forum under the name "Jane" and I know she has carried out a lot of research about her uncle. According to Bill Chorley's 1943 Losses, the aircraft crashed at Eind (Limburg).

    For the record, the Harlem crew had operated with 199 from early 1943 when the Squadron were with 1 Group and were flying Wellingtons. On the night they died, F/Sgt. Harlem was flying his 31st. operation.

    Regards

    Douglas

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