37 Squadron - Wellington Q-Queenie May '43

[Blades]

Hi Dave,
It would certainly appear as if John Blades was with 40 Squadron and not 37 Squadron as his name doesn't appear in any of the 37 Squadron crews.

Regards,
Rob Jerram.

I assume you mean John Blades "was with 40 Squadron" temporarily, as he came to 37 squadron via 108's disbandment - whilst 40 never took any 108 crew (37, 70 & 148)
His notes clearly state 37 and conform with 37's movements from Nov thru May 1943.

[dennis_burke]

Colin,

hav eyou obtained your fathers service record from the RAF, there may well be a temporary (or otherwise, don't dismiss peoples suggestions, they are just trying to help based on their evidence) assignment mentioned in it.

[dfuller52]

That is odd, Rob, as the diary clearly states his "RAF Address" as 37 Sqn from Nov. 42 to May 30, 1943.

The other problem here is that the different diary entries don't match up.

The 236 Group Adjt. has it as June 4 (which could be a mistake but squares with Rob's dad's diary).
John Blades' note on the back of the photo of 'Q' Queenie is June 6 (which squares with the adjutant's account).
But HF697 crashed on June 10/11 (possibly another incident?)
And two incidents are mentioned in Rob's father's diary.

We really need someone who has the 40 Sqn ORB to see what it says. It would also help to get the form 1180s for the five a/c Rob listed.

And we are still left with the puzzle of where John Blades' crewmates deaths are recorded.
If they are the four listed earlier from 40 Sqn, killed on the second date (with one survivor), where was the sixth man in that crew?

And, of course, the fact that Blades isn't in the 37 ORB.

A real rubic's cube this one is.

[Blades]

Hello Dennis

I have a MOD letter to my Dad dated Oct 1984 which states Certified True Statement of Service (Rank in Air Crew Service - Sergeant/Air Gunner, Rank in Service - Corporal, conduct Very Good etc) along with Medal Entitlement (1939-45 Star, Air Crew Europe Star, Africa Star and Clasp, Defence Medal, War Medal)
Interestingly the cover letter from the MOD states "I regret to inform you that the Documents and Photographs to which you refer are not held at this office" Oh to know what those items refer too...

I will have to send a request for information (next of kin) form off for his squadron details, but I need to obtain a copy Death Cert from Manchester, (I'm in Donegal) plus £30, though I'm not sure what information I'll get back from them.

I wouldn't dream of dismissing any suggestions (and so sorry if that is the impression I've given) the more suggestions the more I have to go on, (in fact, I've since researched 40 squadron ORB ref from the Nat Arc AIR 27/412 in case I can get over in 2011)

dfuller, A real rubics cube indeed

Thanks again folks
Colin

[RobJ]

Hi Colin,
You mentioned a list of names your father has written down. If you can find the time list these on the board as I have quite a few names in my father's diary from most Squadrons in ME at time and we may be able to narrow the field down this way.

Regards,
Rob Jerram.

[Blades]

Hello Rob

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, here's the list:

Atkinson, Jack
Babington, Ernie
Brewerton, Tom
Broad, Reg
Brown, Jim
Bryon, Fred
Collinson, Bill
Dunn, Bill
Edwards, 'Eddie'
Evans, 'Lofty'
Forbes, Jim
Gardner, Hank
Head, Bill
Knoakes, Ronny
Lawson, Harold
Loosely, Harry
McLean, 'Jock'
McGinty, 'Geordie'
Mills, Sid
Naylor 'Ginger'
Pask, Bob
Piper, Alf
Randall 'Red'
Revell, Sid
Roberts 'Brum'
Shain,Taff (?)
Shepherd, Bill
Smith 'Git' (really)
Smith, Pete
Walker, Mickey
White, 'Chalky'
White, Sid
Wilkinson, Cliff
Woodhouse, Keith

It would be good if if we could find any of these fellows.

I should point out that my Dad played all lot of football (and Hockey) whilst in the ME, a number of those names may possibly be team-mates.
He played football for 107sqd, 111mu Cairo, 4ers, 6ers, RAF Bilbeis, RAF Ramleh & RAF kilo 17 (pre-war he played for Bury - and whilst in the ME he also played for representative teams from both Glasgow Celtic and Arsenal, although the later must have been hard, he was a die-hard Manchester City supporter lol)

I've also spoken to my brother who tells me that, near the end of his life, Dad did speak to him at some length regarding his time in the RAF, he will compile his memories from those conversations and get back to me, (he's an author - so I'm thinking later rather than sooner) I'll certainly post my findings back here, hopefully it may help with a solution to this mystery.

Thanks again
Colin

If it helps, Dads Wellington had Pegasus XVIII engines.

[dfuller52]

Hi Colin,

Did you run any of those names through the CWGC database to see if there is a group of them that died on the same day?

[Blades]

Just ran them through the db, no trace, worth a try though thanks for the suggestion. I suspected that these chaps all made it through,
I have no record of any other airmen,

[David Gunby]

The aircraft written off when W/O Kennedy crashed on take off were HE660, HE861 and HZ108.

No crew involved.

David.

[Blades]

Wow, thanks David,

As the aircraft we're fully bombed and fuelled I'm wondering if the crew weren't too far away, if not actually located in the a/c itself (checking radio equipment perhaps - Dad) the plot thickens..

you wouldn't happen to have their call sign letter by any chance?

Interestingly, and going off at a tangent, a Wellington reg: HE660 is referenced here, http://www.bombercrew.com/432/holmes.htm were a/c code numbers duplicated?