Halifax Ditching 202 Sq? Off Western Isles

[highgroundsman]

Hi All,

Would anyone know of a Halifax, possibly 202 Sq Aldergrove, lost after a ditching off the Western Isles of Scotland, area of Colonsay, around 1948/1949. I am not 100% certain of type but aircraft I am told was Aldergrove. It is understood crew survived and picked up by Royal Navy ship.

Any help very much appreciated.
Regards.
Dave.

[Dick]

Hi Dave
Can't comment on the ditching but if it was 202 Sqn then they were based at Aldergrove from Oct 46 to Aug 64, with a detachment at Gib from aug 49, and they were flying Halifax GR 6s and A9s .They retained Halifax's until May 51(RAF Squadrons , C G Jefford)
Regards
Dick

[malcolmmacdonald]

I have Halifax III - number ST798 from 202 squadron based at Aldergrove, ditching 15 miles SSE of Barra Head on 29 December 1950.

Is this the same a/c?

I would be delighted to get details of the crew on ST798.

Regards
Malcolm

[Errol Martyn]

Colin Cummings' 'Last Take-Off' volume has:

29 Dec 50, ST798, Halifax Met 6, 202 Sqn, 15 miles off Barra Head, Hebrides, 8 killed.

This aircraft was engaged on a meteorological flight when it crashed into the sea. The cause of the crash could not be determined but some reports suggested the Halifax was on fire before impact. Squadron Leader Cox had served as a war substantive wing commander and had married the daughter of a London doctor the previous March. On 16th January 1951, a trawler recovered Squadron Leader Cox's body together with a small amount of wreckage but the other crew were not found.

Squadron Leader Terence Anthony Cox, DSO, DFC
Pilot Officer Donald Nattriss
Sergeant Edward Arthur Keeble
Sergeant John Frederick Stanley Black
Flight Sergeant John Henry Cobbold
Sergeant William Richard Martindale
Sergeant Stuart Gordon Purches
Sergeant Gerald Walklate

Errol

[highgroundsman]

Good effort Guys,

But I fear not the aircraft for I am told the crew survived and were picked up so still a bit of a mystery this one. Can`t see anything else in Colin Cummings books though.

Regards.
Dave.

[paulmcmillan]

18.4.47 Halifax Met 6 ST807 of 202 Sqn Crashed West of Shetlands- Cause: Crashed in sea during met flight - Cause not known - 9 Killed. - Source Broken Wings (Air Britain)

Final Landings has more detail including names of those killed - Location: 62.00 North/01.00 West and the fact that it was assumed that the pilot lost control of the aircraft, probably at low level but this is conjecture. Some wreckage was located in the sea.

Sqn Ldr Douglas Leonard Bisgood aged 27 DFC
Pilot II John Singer Anderson aged 24
Flt Lt Donal James McMahon aged 25
Navigator II Paul Bramwell Higgins
Engineer II Ronald Miles aged 24
Flt Sgt Albert Alexander Thompson aged 23
Signall III Fred Orwin aged 22
Engineer II Stanley Baldwin
Signaller II David James aged 23

[paulmcmillan]

This came up in January 2008

http://www.rafcommands.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2923

Also see:

http://www.202-sqn-assoc.co.uk/Requests_list.html

Note the Times has a different location!

[paulmcmillan]

There is a third possiblity - From Final Landings

9 July 1949 ST818 Halifax Met 6 202 Sqn Missing at Sea 6 Killed

Aircraft took off at about 0850 hours on a routine patrol sortie and communication was maintained with it until 1143 hours, at which time it was reported that the aircraft would begin its return to base after another 15 minutes. Nothing further was heard from the aircraft and it was lost without trace. The weather was favourable except for some patches of sea fog and continous non turbulent stratus cloud above 12 feet.

Pilot I Eric Harold Tiller
Pilot II Donald Alfred John William Britton Cross
Navigator II Charles Herbert Temple Broughton
Engineer II James Bell Dale
Signaller I Percy McKenzie Graham
Signaller II Thomas William Mawson
Sgt Edward Clarance Cook - Met Obs

I went through all othe other STnnn Halifax serials and no more were lost as sea though others were written off
in landing accidents etc

[paulmcmillan]

Could a couple of different stories be confused.

23rd April 1948 RG381 Halifax Met 6 of 202 Sqn was ditched in Lough Neagh with 0 casualties

Final Landings has

"The aircraft was on an air test and local flying sortie and was at 8000 feet, having been airborne for about an hour. The starboard inner engine started to overspeed and oil was seen pouring from the reduction gearbox. The fire extinguisher was operated but appeared not to function and the propeller, which appeared to be sliding backwards, and forwards along the shaft, would not feather. The pilot decied to ditch the aircraft and this was accomplished succesfully"

I don't suppose there is ANY CHANCE it is still there?? Or was it recovered

Update: I seem to remember seeing a picture of this aircraft in either Flypast or Aeroplane during recovery from Lough Neagh - Though it could have been another aircraft

[Lyffe]

Dave,

How sure are you of the date? I ask because 202 Sqn would not normally operate near Colonsay.

I believe the incident occurred on 21 November 1944, and the aircraft was Halifax LL510 of 518 Sqn, then operating from Tiree. The aircraft had taken off for an air-test to investigate airframe vibration reported by the previous crew. The vibration was noticed immediately the aircraft became airborne, and found to be caused by the outer starboard engine. Shortly after the engine caught fire, leaving the captain no choice but to ditch. This he did successfully, and the crew were picked up by HMS Flanders two hours later, and returned to Tiree, disembarking at Scarinish. Tiree is not a million miles from Colonsay.

The crew was:

F/L Freddie Green (Pilot)
F/O Des Newton (2nd pilot)
W/O John Bristow (Nav)
F/S Ozaist (MAO)
F/S Stan Loader (F/Eng)
W/O Ellacott (Wop/AG)
W/O Drought ( " )
F/S Gordon Wilkes ( " )
Sgt Nicholl (Fitter A)

The above is summarised from 'Even the birds were walking', but a fuller account, written by the navigator, and including some dramatic photographs, can be found at http://www.oldnautibits.com/features/aerofeature3.shtml

Brian